From owner-freebsd-security@freebsd.org Wed Nov 11 22:29:23 2015 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-security@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C7ECA2CE69 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 22:29:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rsimmons0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qg0-x22c.google.com (mail-qg0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c04::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EF4C81333 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 22:29:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rsimmons0@gmail.com) Received: by qgea14 with SMTP id a14so35004176qge.0 for ; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 14:29:21 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=8XF8wvq6WYGViLGeKQeCsCaIK8xSYMmC2Lfi9EqpCwk=; b=muX/Y9ossqcBLs7Q7lvhy07QOVr5s5KWOntY8poe8qTTSJHd+pZe262G352sVUAlqe yf5ec77ktnrutq5Cnpt7wFw6bXeNnlvEmi7JnD72gJgpKj28i7c4PL1TpiB6dki0OjTG +87s/meld4G0irfqaBmOjAvWzyywf/2DpPnq5BPFMoQf3+CxOgnWazusYbkYCR2y/0Os tx8JMd+lFDCpjMBorJ+Y53xso7cXrm8xSXWLf72mQDT4ZQG2UhxS1Gh0GmWUfbadyw96 Uj6C7RRqVVwVSdN+PwTWZ0Viqrpb4YSS35VaZq41wx/IfJP/AAaEFut0wbDrvSUPeMZc MhZA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.140.94.201 with SMTP id g67mr13336255qge.43.1447280961689; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 14:29:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.140.32.75 with HTTP; Wed, 11 Nov 2015 14:29:21 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <20151111014102.GQ65715@funkthat.com> References: <86io5a9ome.fsf@desk.des.no> <20151110175216.GN65715@funkthat.com> <56428C84.8050600@FreeBSD.org> <20151111014102.GQ65715@funkthat.com> Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2015 17:29:21 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: OpenSSH HPN From: Robert Simmons To: freebsd-security@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.20 X-BeenThere: freebsd-security@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: "Security issues \[members-only posting\]" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2015 22:29:23 -0000 I don't think there is such a thing as a trusted network. That is a unicorn these days. If you are using ssh to connect to the VPN server itself over the VPN connection, I can see why that would be useless double encryption. However, if you are connecting to a server on the network on the other side of the VPN, I would still use ssh. No networks should be considered trusted. Here is a great article about Beyond Corp, a Google project based on the idea that trusted networks do not exist in reality, and that systems need to be built with this in mind. https://static.googleusercontent.com/media/research.google.com/en//pubs/archive/43231.pdf On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 8:41 PM, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > Bryan Drewery wrote this message on Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 16:32 -0800: > > On 11/10/15 9:52 AM, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > > My vote is to remove the HPN patches. First, the NONE cipher made more > > > sense back when we didn't have AES-NI widely available, and you were > > > seriously limited by it's performance. Now we have both aes-gcm and > > > chacha-poly which it's performance should be more than acceptable for > > > today's uses (i.e. cipher performance is 2GB/sec+). > > > > AES-NI doesn't help the absurdity of double-encrypting when using scp or > > rsync/ssh over an encrypted VPN, which is where NONE makes sense to use > > for me. > > Different layers of protection... > > Do you disable all encryption when you're transiting trusted networks > like your VPN? If you don't, why is that ssh session so special? > > -- > John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 415 225 5579 > > "All that I will do, has been done, All that I have, has not." > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-security@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-security > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-security-unsubscribe@freebsd.org > " >