From owner-freebsd-questions Wed Apr 25 18:40:57 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from guru.mired.org (okc-65-26-235-186.mmcable.com [65.26.235.186]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 633C037B423 for ; Wed, 25 Apr 2001 18:40:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mwm@mired.org) Received: (qmail 85087 invoked by uid 100); 25 Apr 2001 22:54:12 -0000 From: Mike Meyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15079.21908.314160.884392@guru.mired.org> Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 17:54:12 -0500 To: Andrew Hesford Cc: Mike Meyer , questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OT: Ports & packages don't belong in /usr/local In-Reply-To: <20010425172226.A75534@cec.wustl.edu> References: <64957189@toto.iv> <15079.19123.571171.159852@guru.mired.org> <20010425172226.A75534@cec.wustl.edu> X-Mailer: VM 6.90 under 21.1 (patch 14) "Cuyahoga Valley" XEmacs Lucid X-face: "5Mnwy%?j>IIV\)A=):rjWL~NB2aH[}Yq8Z=u~vJ`"(,&SiLvbbz2W`;h9L,Yg`+vb1>RG% *h+%X^n0EZd>TM8_IB;a8F?(Fb"lw'IgCoyM.[Lg#r\ Sender: owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Andrew Hesford types: > On Wed, Apr 25, 2001 at 05:07:47PM -0500, Mike Meyer wrote: > > Andrew Hesford types: > You make good points. I think we're the only two guys on this thread > that make any sense. What we have here is simple matter of preference. I > think you will concede that packages do NOT belong in the /usr tree > along with the base system. This is not what /usr was intended for. If > anything, I'll bet you created a /usr/local/pkg or something similar to > segregate ports and packages? Thank you. I already said I put them in /usr/opt, based on my Solaris experience. If I'd know that NetBSD used /usr/pkgs (I think that's it), I would have used that. /usr/local/pkg would serve the same purpose - it segregates package and local name space. Personally, I want to use the same backup strategy on packages as /usr, so I put them on the same file system, which makes /usr/ slightly faster. > People before were arguing that packages belong in /usr, the way linux > packaging systems dump everything in /usr. This is absolutely > ridiculous. Surely you conced that the ports are site-specific, albeit > easily rebuilt in the event of problems. Therefore, the belong somewhere > in the local tree. No, I don't think they belong in the local tree. I can see there are good reasons for people not wanting them in /usr, just as I don't want them in /usr/local. I can also see why some people would want them in /usr/local - I'm just not one of them. Once you give them a directory of their own, you can put them pretty much anywhere with a symlink, including merging them back into the local tree or /usr. If you dumped them in /usr, you'd take that ability away from people, which is sufficient reason to me to *not* do that. > The difference between you and me, then, is that I don't care to > separate the stuff I retrieved by hand and the stuff in the ports; you > do. This is exactly why UNIX is configurable: skillful administrators > have different beliefs and preferences about where things belong. > However, I think it is poor practice to dump everything in /usr. No > ports belong there. Like I said, if there *is* a port that belongs in > /usr, the committers should pull the port into the contrib tree and > elminate the port, like was done with OpenSSH. If you've read the libh project document, you'll notice that changing the OS distribution so that the OS is bundled as packages - complete with dependencies - is on the list of things to do. This will provide the -RELEASE user with flexibility in installing the system that's currently reserved for people building from sources. OpenSSH would probably have been part of the base system long ago if they could have beeen legally distributed from California. OpenBSD avoided that problem by being located in Canada. http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-questions" in the body of the message