From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Fri Jun 1 15:09:48 2018 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C34FAEFD486 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2018 15:09:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-it0-x233.google.com (mail-it0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 50C4A80DA6 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2018 15:09:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-it0-x233.google.com with SMTP id 144-v6so2186992iti.5 for ; Fri, 01 Jun 2018 08:09:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=fQgDG31HyG87jbJqpBV8ns/mrh7pbI7orL1fDE4J0sU=; b=lvsHbv2+gFT1fyr7sVeDaKi1o17JS/99VZ6X5aC3vcqIg/xOiOUPue1Dee2Khxe35M OOC04NGU6Kk9IMMxX1c+cyUMfFcpeWWGlIrl/ePGu4fSSI+7zR706ELspbQseW+9FBK3 Oxp/Dn7fquRgTMNzqjNgr+Y+UmE23b/UzmlBR2Ss11lJboNVtgtnRHSvUb5Qe3DH4u9B lu1Di6ps8XqYcleF3M4n50W+NynzDtnLg8w1W82AJG3vskSfVDnQlKPufqLOc85S1FSA t6ubxg15zZk7br5FqX9OG9PkNqM1Yylrej9xmOZbjxUTwpKiTSDL2+KQsCFHSTh5qpmQ gfFQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=fQgDG31HyG87jbJqpBV8ns/mrh7pbI7orL1fDE4J0sU=; b=RnRdFUEd16hKxNhDv0+vlZ3L6lQq/DsBupzU1uAqcOinP49rW2Jjx4Z2RfsAf6xGva gzEn/RYiUofP4pjYzeX1n6QLFy5IAjxhmXeJurujKFnvEBu1wNhgJ6UMEYmfGPU7n2kZ sE8AhyDkI/5so/Nrocpl60dICUwtDuVZ3OnhJFS0+5c5MFEzAFeIjkdfDqhjyj/5xFZD zpDLk8c5MNSPXM0VwVQjd5gRA0Vu+u3npZR39eJw2gQq1xvusBNRXsHAEpf260AKeCvz zQLN7XmS95cz+QGwRYXC+v3Ga34KjeSzzwHtof09JbyFgyd6KSbc72PqBOd0VJEralEf oSlA== X-Gm-Message-State: APt69E1oLiX+cU4Ffw0Px25Hb66RjebfGbSdKTv3IJRMiJ9YNC4jyvlY OH36KE6OcnLxzHoE3idpznjm1YOrRT9BQol1m59sPA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADUXVKJku9XgYwpHpsKPWYFYh2h2oAcmiuXL7stidgJj5vm+qZEfEsJ/mDqBTyXcGV35+Xifv3/DJsPZg5LAXFXIJN0= X-Received: by 2002:a24:efc2:: with SMTP id i185-v6mr2776249ith.57.1527865787586; Fri, 01 Jun 2018 08:09:47 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: wlosh@bsdimp.com Received: by 2002:a4f:d028:0:0:0:0:0 with HTTP; Fri, 1 Jun 2018 08:09:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Originating-IP: [2603:300b:6:5100:1052:acc7:f9de:2b6d] In-Reply-To: References: <1407.1527801278@critter.freebsd.dk> From: Warner Losh Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2018 09:09:47 -0600 X-Google-Sender-Auth: M1ApE5TsJ39LkByeO1DkrxADrMw Message-ID: Subject: Re: PRs are being closed for bogus reasons :-( To: Bob Bishop Cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Dieter BSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.26 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2018 15:09:49 -0000 On Fri, Jun 1, 2018 at 8:53 AM, wrote: > > > On 1 Jun 2018, at 15:41, Warner Losh wrote: > > > >> On Fri, Jun 1, 2018 at 8:10 AM, Bob Bishop wrote: > >> Hi, > >> > >> > On 31 May 2018, at 22:14, Poul-Henning Kamp > wrote: > >> > > >> > -------- > >> > In message mail.gmail.com> > >> > , Warner Losh writes: > >> > > >> >> There's a problem with the PR database: there's too many bugs. > >> > > >> > And despite the valiant efforts of a number of people over the > >> > lifetime of the project, it has always had so many bugs that > >> > everybody just threw their hands in the air and walked away. > >> > > >> > The way to improve the situation is to fix PR's, not to complain > >> > about PRs. > >> > >> Indeed. But look at the number of PRs with patches that are stuck in > that state. Not pretty. > > > > Over the years I've committed dozens of PRs that had patches in them. > The sad truth is that only about 10-15% of them have comitable patches in > them when submitted. And that number decays over time as things age in > bugzilla. [etc] > > Sure. But the best a non-comitter can do is to supply a patch tested > against HEAD. If the patch rots because it hasn=E2=80=99t been committed = six months > down the line it=E2=80=99s not my fault. > Well, not quite true. I've had several people send me pointers to bugs over the years and engage me when I tell them that the patch isn't quite right. That conversation is easier, to my mind, in Phabricator, though. There's no substitute for making good connections and motivating volunteers to want to help you. That gives much better results than filing and forgetting and hoping for the best. As a committer, I find it a low return on investment to go looking at random PRs. I find it a much higher return on investment when I have a history with someone (even a short one). Fixing this broken state of affairs is not going to be easy... Warner