From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Mar 1 01:26:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA19321 for freebsd-chat-outgoing; Sun, 1 Mar 1998 01:26:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from const. (willow20.verinet.com [199.45.181.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA19316 for ; Sun, 1 Mar 1998 01:26:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from allenc@verinet.com) Received: (from allenc@localhost) by const. (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA04411 for freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 1 Mar 1998 02:27:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from allenc) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 02:27:14 -0700 (MST) From: allen campbell Message-Id: <199803010927.CAA04411@const.> To: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: newbies mailing list Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Real Hackers never get defensive. This needs to be in a FAQ somewhere (if it isn't already.) Maybe even an RFC. Newbie: How am I to deal with condescending and offensive responses to my questions? FAQ: Space them. This will probably happen fifty percent of the time you make an attempt to communicate, whether or not you are correct. Make a spelling or grammar error, get your facts the slightest bit wrong or fail to read every conceivable piece of documentation remotely related to your subject and you _will_ evoke brutal feedback. The single most important thing you need to participate is a thick skin. > It's worth a try. Tell people that they can post to either list, but > they'll get more sympathetic treatment from auntie than they will on > -questions. For participants in -questions, there are expectations that a newbie may not be ready for. Using their mailer properly, or actually reading the basic documentation for starters. Perhaps a -newbies list would provide a kinder, gentler place for a thoughtful newbie to start. At least when some hot head jumps all over an amateur in -newbies, they do so knowing they are in the wrong. I am no long time expert. It wasn't too long ago that I sent messages from Netscape mailers. I learned rather quickly about the importance of line breaks, and that others might judge me on the contents of my headers. If I had had a -newbies list in which to make these initial mistakes, I may have done less damage in the process. > Right. Of course, giving up FreeBSD because they think it's too hard > might be the right choice. Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean > people aren't out to get you. I have since configured sendmail with a proper hostname and to masquerade as my ISP for proper return addresses (among other things), and learned how to use fetchmail, mail(1), fmt and ispell. Some of us _do_ pay attention, Greg. :) > What do you others think? I think you and Sue are trying to solve different problems. Sue wants a place where the poster has the right to not feel intimidated while posting thoughtful questions. You want users to read the docs, follow the conventions and ask worthwhile questions. I think -newbies will have a very bad signal to noise ratio, but the noise in newbies will be noise that didn't end up somewhere else. Allen Campbell allenc@verinet.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message