From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon May 31 7:12:20 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dfw-ix16.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix16.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C565914E50; Mon, 31 May 1999 07:12:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from asami@cs.berkeley.edu) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix16.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id JAA00982; Mon, 31 May 1999 09:11:34 -0500 (CDT) Received: from sji-ca41-214.ix.netcom.com(209.111.208.214) by dfw-ix16.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma000927; Mon May 31 09:11:18 1999 Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.hip.berkeley.edu (8.9.2/8.6.9) id HAA51369; Mon, 31 May 1999 07:10:10 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 07:10:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905311410.HAA51369@silvia.hip.berkeley.edu> X-Authentication-Warning: silvia.hip.berkeley.edu: asami set sender to asami@cs.berkeley.edu using -f To: mladavac@metropolitan.at Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C1100276179631@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> (message from Ladavac Marino on Mon, 31 May 1999 15:22:33 +0200) Subject: Re: a two-level port system? (fwd) From: asami@FreeBSD.ORG (Satoshi - Ports Wraith - Asami) References: <55586E7391ACD211B9730000C1100276179631@r-lmh-wi-100.corpnet.at> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * From: Ladavac Marino I don't really have time to butt in (I have to hop on a plane in a few hours and I haven't finished the presentation slides) but I'd like to throw in my two cents before this gets out of hand. * [ML] This would offer an advantage over the existing system * only if all ports are updated to the new schema, which is a lot of work. * shar approach could be easily mechanised, and requires no changes in the * makefiles or the ports themselves. OTOH, shar offers no advantages to * the folks who build all ports (or most of them) because they end up * creating all directories anyway. I think Satoshi is the only such * person :) I don't think that's really an issue. The question is, what is the problem you are trying to solve here? What are the requirements of the system? The requirements are: @ Easy to maintain. I have a tree checked out, I can go in there and type "make package", tweak the Makefile and type "make clean package", and type "cvs commit" when I'm done. A lot of committers work this way. Can you beat this? @ Version control. Can you check out an arbitrary version of any file? I want to do something like "give me the changes in Makefile between yesterday and today". @ Low on bandwidth. CVS combined with "individual files" approach is pretty darn efficient when it comes to not sending more than what changed. @ Easy to search. Does it let me grep something in all md5 files or all PLISTs? The current approach does this by letting the filesystem take care of the individual files. A shar file per port solution is just moving part of the problem from the kernel (filesystem) to userland (shar/unshar). Now, the problems are: @ It takes a long time to...what? cvsup the tree? That's already pretty fast. Read all files? Why do you want to read all files? It's more likely that you want to read all the Makefiles or all the md5 files or some such, which shar will slow down considerably. CVS update the entire tree? Ok, so that's pretty slow. But do people really do it often enough to hurt? @ It is large. Ok, so it's 44MB (the first poster had the size completely wrong -- probably had some distfiles or work/ subdirs lying around). That's less than 20KB per port. Ok, so you can keep only the Makefile, or even less, and let the network do the work for you whenever you type something. But does anybody have a system that has such a wonderful network connection but yet can't spare 44MB of disk space? It seems to me that you guys are arguing about a problem that doesn't really exist. Or at least all ideas proposed so far seem to hurt more than help. ;) Satoshi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message