From owner-freebsd-arch Wed Feb 12 8:15:47 2003 Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E1D037B401 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 08:15:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2018E43F3F for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 08:15:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wollman@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu) Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1CGFdbs025694 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=OK); Wed, 12 Feb 2003 11:15:39 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from wollman@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1CGFdGG025691; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 11:15:39 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from wollman) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 11:15:39 -0500 (EST) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <200302121615.h1CGFdGG025691@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: Wes Peters Cc: arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: syslog.conf syntax change (multiple program/host specifications) In-Reply-To: <200302121521.33506.wes@softweyr.com> References: <20030210114930.GB90800@melusine.cuivre.fr.eu.org> <200302120632.36583.wes@softweyr.com> <200302121411.h1CEBRSe025071@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> <200302121521.33506.wes@softweyr.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG < said: > So you're preferring the software over the human operator. I would not necessarily jump to that conclusion. What I want to eschew is a proliferation of lots of little languages, each one subtly different, such that users are forced to learn all of them. We already have: foocap fstab group inetd.conf files manpath.config master.passwd named.conf and dhcpd.conf newsyslog.conf nsswitch.conf ntp.conf pam.d/* passwd pccard.conf ppp.conf {rc,periodic}.conf shells and ftpusers ssh{,d}_config syslog.conf ttys Every single one of these has a different syntax that the admin must learn in addition to the relevant semantics, and which any sort of front-end or configuration-analysis tool must be able to interpret, in order to do anything useful with the programs they control. The benefit of something like XML (or Lisp, for that matter) is that, while still providing for functionally significant differences, the *lexical* structure is identical across many functions -- and this makes it much easier to use other tools (like structured editors) to maintain and document the files. Yes, XML syntax is pretty hateful -- but because it is lexically regular, my editor can do much of the work for me. It can do even more of the work when the XML is coupled with a DTD so that it understands more of the structure. -GAWollman To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message