From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 23:26:44 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0698C16A4DA; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 23:26:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jason@dixongroup.net) Received: from mail.dixongroup.net (mail.dixongroup.net [144.202.240.239]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3355743D4C; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 23:26:43 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jason@dixongroup.net) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mail.dixongroup.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A78A9007D; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:26:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail.dixongroup.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.dixongroup.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30981-13; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:26:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.0.11] (pool-70-22-99-195.balt.east.verizon.net [70.22.99.195]) by mail.dixongroup.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2BB590074; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:26:41 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <20060831195609.P82634@hub.org> References: <20060830232723.GU10101@multics.mit.edu> <98f5a8830608301731s2b0663e3g94b0bd32f8a06a78@mail.gmail.com> <950621ad0608310654h78ae0023g346abd108815ae72@mail.gmail.com> <20060831110112.J82634@hub.org> <20060831184715.B82634@hub.org> <20060831223543.GC15085@jp.animata.net> <20060831195609.P82634@hub.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <79F6D7CB-BA0B-4389-A716-570B62F1B185@dixongroup.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jason Dixon Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:26:07 -0400 To: Marc G.Fournier X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at dixongroup.net Cc: miros-discuss@mirbsd.org, misc usage list , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, netbsd-users@netbsd.org Subject: Re: The future of NetBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 23:26:44 -0000 On Aug 31, 2006, at 7:01 PM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Thu, 31 Aug 2006, Pedro Martelletto wrote: > >> On Thu, Aug 31, 2006 at 06:50:00PM -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >>> Even at the kernel level? Look at device drivers and vendors as one >>> example ... companies like adaptec have to write *one* device >>> driver, for, >>> what, 50+ distributions of linux ... for us, they need to write >>> one for >>> FreeBSD, one for NetBSD, one for OpenBSD, and *now* one for >>> DragonflyBSD >>> ... if we had *at least* a common API for that sort of stuff, it >>> might be >>> asier to get support at the vendor level, no? >> >> Vendors should release documentation, not write drivers. > > In a perfect world, they all would ... this is not a perfect > world, it is one dominated by Linux or Microsoft ... I use Adaptec > drivers on 3 of my servers, because, in 4.x, they were rock > solid ... in 6.x, they have a problem ... I'd like to be able to go > out and upgrade those servers to a vendor that provides > "documentation", but its a cost I can't afford at this time ... so, > should I then switch to Linux because they do welcome 'vendor > written drivers'? Rhetorical question, since I do not consider > switching to Linux an option ... instead, I'm trying to do > something to help *BSD advocates promote *BSD to those vendors (see > http://www.bsdstats.org) by showing them that we aren't just a > 'hobbiest operating system' ... what my point is, though, is if we > aren't willing to accept 'vendor written drivers', then it is *we* > that are limiting our growth but limiting what hardware we can run > stably on ... If everyone had your attitude, there would be no *BSD. Settling for "good enough" means never making progress. -- Jason Dixon DixonGroup Consulting http://www.dixongroup.net