From nobody Mon Jan 15 20:53:03 2024 X-Original-To: freebsd-questions@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4TDPVl4tLRz57XxC for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2024 20:53:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paulbeard@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm1-x331.google.com (mail-wm1-x331.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::331]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4TDPVk5wVWz4nVQ for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2024 20:53:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from paulbeard@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20230601 header.b=ZmHrAXfZ; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of paulbeard@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::331 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=paulbeard@gmail.com Received: by mail-wm1-x331.google.com with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-40e80046264so8386405e9.0 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2024 12:53:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1705351995; x=1705956795; darn=freebsd.org; h=cc:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=fXCMavo8ir2HW1+Annr+F22tF1x2GovmBJ8CQi3zjkY=; b=ZmHrAXfZyRELX95ZthDem6pPWBq3zlO7airoXpY7R7ivDJMNJiooFM5kPSKogq5Jr6 gR2GVE908DTJZPipORUxNs01+zJYivw3fqQ54CRBgeIkYLMHc7Lh0OceXrYZs3MZ6qZ8 ajXin2cUd/FOTGmPZiP295o7eyQG6+XB3vdDo5iga4vZYYnCAjkv1jiVgCHDyTjvK5l4 PVF63xK1KL9oxgVZZ9NTBg8NwpwbG5JIqwv5vcAlPEkU8NKKAGauSZcT4AWprjE944Hu TM51hC4I0HHjvGJvFOQvpMxyGmndJYUZp/os03y/k1OLceadecaLLTG2TOrcDQ1xHD9Z s+pA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1705351995; x=1705956795; h=cc:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=fXCMavo8ir2HW1+Annr+F22tF1x2GovmBJ8CQi3zjkY=; b=m3DJG93wovE0hnxM9GLC4WqFBtqVKGDxJLsjl7s6mEg+LogKzdIupjW53lTc26Znot ptX6v7DzmG2aPpCOFXGW24Ws2IvojeqsLviZGrNgSI80UnwqcrgNMSUWc28R/UH/fBPQ m6caJnvY4A6Dc9b6TKXq+wTFP4YWTU7UeN/rfceTcxJLiJD88EmlmjsCFlEyRe0wrL0O Cu6C9UtJY9B6IlXC7tpPZW3Mdm4wRZCCT0VKMLq7q46G8GdGEA+y3ao51YszIyAUzuPk j+e/p97KDMHrFgdT5yXIokqNBkjSMIzy1V3XRzrVURLOdxNoZxmOcSIIwEvNdVQ4BxgV Si/A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxOX9r4w33bYUuPHGuwfW1dFIe1BqUaikxrroclSkep7fcgudUe o30M+Rs0uCGETmFq7q+Ur2UARJfT9IEd+7Mzdus= X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:3793:b0:40e:6334:7a96 with SMTP id o19-20020a05600c379300b0040e63347a96mt3143590wmr.134.1705351994890; Mon, 15 Jan 2024 12:53:14 -0800 (PST) List-Id: User questions List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-questions List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: paul beard Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2024 12:53:03 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: How to upgrade an EOL FreeBSD release or how to make it working again Cc: Mario Marietto , FreeBSD Mailing List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000dfc902060f02334f" X-Spamd-Bar: - X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.00 / 15.00]; MISSING_TO(2.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20230601]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com,freebsd.org]; MISSING_XM_UA(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROMTLD(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::331:from] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4TDPVk5wVWz4nVQ --000000000000dfc902060f02334f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is usually where someone asks if OP has heard of NetBSD. https://www.netbsd.org On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 10:16=E2=80=AFAM David Chisnall wrote: > On 15 Jan 2024, at 16:46, Mario Marietto wrote: > > > > The ARM Chromebook is based on armv7,it is still recent. > > For reference, the ARMv7 architecture was introduced in 2005. The last > cores that implemented the architecture were released in 2014. This is n= ot > a =E2=80=98recent=E2=80=99 architecture, it=E2=80=99s one that=E2=80=99s = 19 years old and has been largely > dead for several years. > > > But let's change perspective for a moment,don't think about the ARM > Chromebook. My question is : how to upgrade FreeBSD when it goes EOL. > > Generally, run `freebsd-update`. This is a very different question from > =E2=80=98how do I do a new install of an old an unsupported version?' > > > I ask this because there is a huge difference here between FreeBSD and > Linux. Today if you need to use , for example Ubuntu 14.0, you can use it > as is. Yes,there will be a lot of bugs,but it will work without crashes. > But if you want to use an old FreeBSD system,nothing will work for you. > So,do you know some methods to install even packages or ports ? You > know,there are cases when you need to do some experiments so that you can > keep your machine off the internet,so you aren't scared that someone can > compromise it. Totally prohibiting the users to use an old system,removin= g > ports and packages is not a choice that I approve of. And I'm not the onl= y > one that thinks like this. > > If you want to use an old and unsupported version of FreeBSD, no one is > stopping you, but: > > - You will need to build the releases. The source code is still in git, > you can. The scripts for building the release images are right there in > the repo. Just grab the relevant release or releng branch and go. > > - You will need to build packages. Newer versions of the ports tree wil= l > not be tested with the older release, so you may need to use an older > checkout of the ports tree. Poudriere will build a package repo for you. > > In both cases, if you=E2=80=99re using older versions you almost certainl= y *will* > have security vulnerabilities. The project strongly advises you not to d= o > this and not to blame us when you install known-insecure software and end > up compromised. > > The project does not have enough active contributors to keep maintaining > things indefinitely. This is why release have a five-year supported > lifetime. If you want to pick up an old branch and maintain it, you=E2= =80=99re > welcome to. In the past, companies have picked up old branches and > maintained them for customers that had a dependency on them. If you want > to pay someone to maintain an old branch (and have deep pockets) then the= re > are probably a few companies that will happily take your money. > > Maintaining binaries is a slightly different issue, but it=E2=80=99s not = totally > unrelated. Keeping old packages around consumes disk space and costs the > project money (remember, every package is mirrored across the CDN, so thi= s > isn=E2=80=99t just a single disk). Even if it were free, philosophically= , I think > making it easy for users to install known-insecure software is a bad idea > but if you want to keep a package repo with out-of-date packages online > indefinitely then you can. You can run Poudriere and even cross-compile > from a fairly beefy cloud machine quite easily. > > It=E2=80=99s been a while since I did a full package build, but I would g= uess that > you could do a single package build (all ports) for about $50 on a cloud > VM, more (2-3x) if it=E2=80=99s emulated. Storing the results for a smal= l number > of users will cost around $10-20/month. If you think this is an importan= t > thing to do, then you are absolutely welcome to spend your own money on > doing it. > > David > > > --=20 Paul Beard / www.paulbeard.org/ --000000000000dfc902060f02334f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is usually where someone asks if OP has heard of NetB= SD.=C2=A0


On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 10:16=E2=80=AFAM David Chi= snall <theraven@freebsd.org&= gt; wrote:
On 15 Jan 2024, at 16:46, Mario Mariet= to <marietto= 2008@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> The ARM Chromebook is based on armv7,it is still recent.

For reference, the ARMv7 architecture was introduced in 2005.=C2=A0 The las= t cores that implemented the architecture were released in 2014.=C2=A0 This= is not a =E2=80=98recent=E2=80=99 architecture, it=E2=80=99s one that=E2= =80=99s 19 years old and has been largely dead for several years.

> But let's change perspective for a moment,don't think about th= e ARM Chromebook. My question is : how to upgrade FreeBSD when it goes EOL.=

Generally, run `freebsd-update`.=C2=A0 This is a very different question fr= om =E2=80=98how do I do a new install of an old an unsupported version?'= ;

> I ask this because there is a huge difference here between FreeBSD and= Linux. Today if you need to use , for example Ubuntu 14.0, you can use it = as is. Yes,there will be a lot of bugs,but it will work without crashes.=C2= =A0 But if you want to use an old FreeBSD system,nothing will work for you.= So,do you know some methods to install even packages or ports ? You know,t= here are cases when you need to do some experiments so that you can keep yo= ur machine off the internet,so you aren't scared that someone can compr= omise it. Totally prohibiting the users to use an old system,removing ports= and packages is not a choice that I approve of. And I'm not the only o= ne that thinks like this.

If you want to use an old and unsupported version of FreeBSD, no one is sto= pping you, but:

=C2=A0- You will need to build the releases.=C2=A0 The source code is still= in git, you can.=C2=A0 The scripts for building the release images are rig= ht there in the repo.=C2=A0 Just grab the relevant release or releng branch= and go.

=C2=A0- You will need to build packages.=C2=A0 Newer versions of the ports = tree will not be tested with the older release, so you may need to use an o= lder checkout of the ports tree.=C2=A0 Poudriere will build a package repo = for you.=C2=A0

In both cases, if you=E2=80=99re using older versions you almost certainly = *will* have security vulnerabilities.=C2=A0 The project strongly advises yo= u not to do this and not to blame us when you install known-insecure softwa= re and end up compromised.

The project does not have enough active contributors to keep maintaining th= ings indefinitely.=C2=A0 This is why release have a five-year supported lif= etime.=C2=A0 If you want to pick up an old branch and maintain it, you=E2= =80=99re welcome to.=C2=A0 In the past, companies have picked up old branch= es and maintained them for customers that had a dependency on them.=C2=A0 I= f you want to pay someone to maintain an old branch (and have deep pockets)= then there are probably a few companies that will happily take your money.=

Maintaining binaries is a slightly different issue, but it=E2=80=99s not to= tally unrelated.=C2=A0 Keeping old packages around consumes disk space and = costs the project money (remember, every package is mirrored across the CDN= , so this isn=E2=80=99t just a single disk).=C2=A0 Even if it were free, ph= ilosophically, I think making it easy for users to install known-insecure s= oftware is a bad idea but if you want to keep a package repo with out-of-da= te packages online indefinitely then you can.=C2=A0 You can run Poudriere a= nd even cross-compile from a fairly beefy cloud machine quite easily.

It=E2=80=99s been a while since I did a full package build, but I would gue= ss that you could do a single package build (all ports) for about $50 on a = cloud VM, more (2-3x) if it=E2=80=99s emulated.=C2=A0 Storing the results f= or a small number of users will cost around $10-20/month.=C2=A0 If you thin= k this is an important thing to do, then you are absolutely welcome to spen= d your own money on doing it.

David




--
Pa= ul Beard / www.paul= beard.org/
--000000000000dfc902060f02334f--