Date: Sun, 28 Sep 1997 16:12:37 +0930 From: Greg Lehey <grog@lemis.com> To: Wes Peters <softweyr@xmission.com> Cc: FreeBSD Chat <chat@FreeBSD.ORG>, Explicitly not Sean Eric Fagan <sef@devnull> Subject: Re: Microsoft brainrot (was: r-cmds and DNS and /etc/host.conf) Message-ID: <19970928161237.59302@lemis.com> In-Reply-To: <199709280523.XAA21150@obie.softweyr.ml.org>; from Wes Peters on Sat, Sep 27, 1997 at 11:23:11PM -0600 References: <199709272127.OAA11524@usr08.primenet.com> <19970928101941.03210.kithrup.freebsd.chat@lemis.com> <199709280254.TAA20632@kithrup.com> <199709280523.XAA21150@obie.softweyr.ml.org>
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On Sat, Sep 27, 1997 at 11:23:11PM -0600, Wes Peters wrote: > Sean Eric Fagan writes: >> Most people don't need all that information; most people just need to set up >> a fairly standard configuration. That's what the "friendly" tools are for. >> And the files are still editable for the people who know what they are >> doing, and what they want. Yes, but are they? I don't have a problem with people having a GUI if it makes things easier for them. The trouble is, it makes peopl >> >> Having a simple "create a standardized named.boot, <domain>.zone, and >> <network>.rev file" shell script, which would ask a couple of questions, >> would suffice in Terry's case. Of course, he could write that shell script >> pretty easily, and submit it. Except, of course, that people have this >> tendency to just reject anything Terry says *because* it's from Terry :). > > Well, I've known Terry long enough, and personally enough, to never > discredit what he says without careful consideration. As I said in my > previous message, though, I do think both he and Greg missed the point > by 90 degrees. It's not a question of GUI vs. editor, it's a question > of representing the data the user as a meaningful set, which is not > something any of the commonly available DNS tools currently do. > >> And if 99.99% of the computer users can't understand the question, what >> makes you think they'll want to fiddle with the bits that the GUI program >> doesn't allow them to? > > Good point. Perhaps we're asking the wrong questions? ;^) > >> I don't know my license plate. >> >> I know what my car looks like, and I remember vaguely where I parked it. > > Oh, your car is an object, with distinctive physical characteristics, > and you recognize it by those characteristics. In the world of human > interface designers, this is quite important. Unfortunately, the > computer crowd seems to have skipped over this important fact, favoring > long strings of alphanumerics with silly rules about placement instead. > >> This caused me a problem, once, when there was someone parked an identical >> car next to mine (same year, colour, model, and transmission type -- only >> difference was that this imposter car had some rosary beads hanging from the >> rear-view mirror, which I noticed just as I put the key in the lock). > > So you had to "zoom" in order to differentiate the objects? See how we > can make our user interfaces really mimic the real world? (Jeez, I'm > enjoying this.) > >> What that has to do with anything, I don't know -- you're refusing to see >> Terry's point, possibly because it's Terry, and Terry is going on about a >> grand unified field theory when he could have solved the special relativity >> problem and gotten his nobel prize by now. :) > > Greg said: >> Then why don't you do it and import the configuration to your UNIX >> box? I'd like to see it, if only to pick holes in it. How do you set >> up a HINFO RR? An ISDN RR? > >> Most people don't need to set up an ISDN RR. I don't even know what that >> is. I certainly don't have one. >> >> Few people seem to bother setting up an HINFO RR these days. I don't, I >> think. But it's certainly easy enough to set up. > > Many "organizations" disallow HINFOs because they can be a security > breach. Ex: hacker does 'nslookup -type=hinfo foo.bar.com', discovers it > is a FooStation 1100 running Foonix 7.11. He pokes around, discovers > Foonix 7.11 has that awful 11:00 p.m. ftp server switchover bug, and > breaks in. You've just published to him how to break into your server. > The DNS configuration would ideally be configurable enough to remove > these from existing databases and mark fields as "forbidden", so new > and/or naive users wouldn't inadvertantly violate security policy. > > On the other hand, wouldn't it be nifty to shift-click (or right-click, > or whatever) on the "foo" object within the "bar.com" domain view and > see all the possible attributes of "foo." Including those that are not > specified, and those inherited from "bar.com", displayed in some special > manner to indicate they are inherited? > >> Of coruse, since Paul wants to have BIND handle arbitrary resource records, >> it's unlikely that any front-end interface is going to be able to handle all >> cases. > > Unless, of course, you allow the front-end interface to generate > arbitrary RRs as well. This shouldn't be all that difficult. > > -- > "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" > > Wes Peters Softweyr LLC > http://www.xmission.com/~softweyr softweyr@xmission.com -- Greg Lehey LEMIS grog@lemis.com PO Box 460 Tel: +61-8-8388-8286 Echunga SA 5153 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Australia -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: 2.6.2i mQCNAzGpfDEAAAEEAMh6rH1c9+oKgazwGLitshrIFKFSGelccTK1fwnMw2O6SrK8 r0ttvRO42fZa8WXvlsSF1JIAqOJoaBP8HJNv6G/RA1NcKgqQKLc4RmTNnu6MoPe0 a25w25wyKOfzefJTS9dsQhWg2XJlyRo4YMtbSxDOZldq7kmga0Sj8+byVwABAAUR tBNDQyA8Y2NAbWFyY2FkZS5jb20+tAZDb250cm8= =FJvY -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
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