From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Sep 2 4:47:51 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5186C37B400 for ; Mon, 2 Sep 2002 04:47:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hokkshideh2.jetcafe.org (hokkshideh2.jetcafe.org [64.239.180.8]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0F3243E4A for ; Mon, 2 Sep 2002 04:47:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@jetcafe.org) Received: from hokkshideh2.jetcafe.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hokkshideh2.jetcafe.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g82BlW157571; Mon, 2 Sep 2002 04:47:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dave@hokkshideh2.jetcafe.org) Message-Id: <200209021147.g82BlW157571@hokkshideh2.jetcafe.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 To: Terry Lambert Cc: "Neal E. Westfall" , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Why did evolution fail? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2002 04:47:27 -0700 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Terry Lambert writes: > Dave Hayes wrote: >> > See my references. Do the math. The game you are describing has >> > only one set of paredo-optimal results. >> >> I can infer the validity from my observations, thank you. > > Then may I suggest you do so? 8-). Already disproved by my observations. >> A better example is focus on what you want to read rather than >> focusing on what others do not want to read. By your own mechanics, >> if everyone did this, trolls would not have any effect on the >> community. > > There are people who can not do this. I would prefer to have the > contributions of those people, than the participation of the trolls. > If I must lose one or the other, let it be the trolls. I feel exactly the opposite. If someone can't hit a key on the keyboard and render the troll powerless, I don't want to be held hostage to their choices. Good riddance. >> You don't appparently even have the desire to know what real "good" >> is. Hint: it's not the average perception. > The closest you can come to any ideal is to produce a system whose > output asymptotically approaches the ideal. Assuming a numerical space upon which the range of the solution lies, of course. =P >> > We already know how to measure good: it's 100 minus the precentage >> > deviation from the consensus. >> >> I disagree that this is good or has anything to do with real good. > > The consensus definition is all that matters, Actually, it matters the least. > unless you believe we are being judged against some absolute scale > by a higher power. This is a classic religious (and thus, inaccurate) tenet. Good has a definition which is non-obvious except to a 6 year old. Except it's not useful to define good or even quest for it. >> The consensus thinks that getting filthy rich is good. If everyone >> were filthy rich, there wouldn't be a notion of rich or poor, and >> the concept would vanish. Then no one would be rich. > > Or poor. And that would be good. Well, people would focus on not being rich. Then they'd be unhappy. What good is a BMW if you cant brag to your friends because they all have one too? ;) >> > Your insistance on "unknowability" is bizarre. >> >> To you, perhaps. Everything must be knowable in your universe. I can >> live with some things being unknowable. > > You lack of curiousity and determination marks you. There's a misread. I don't lack these things at all. What made you say this? >> > A definition I accept; I don't claim to have originated it. >> >> I don't accept it outside of physics or engineering, surprise >> surprise, but you brought it up therefore it's yours. ;) > > You lack of a belief in gravity will not spare you from its effects. 8-). Actually, it's coupled to survival. If I stop believing in gravity to the point where it stops working, I'll fly off the planet and die in space. So I'd better keep beliveing in gravity, eh? ;) ------ Dave Hayes - Consultant - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org >>> The opinions expressed above are entirely my own <<< We may eventually come to realize that chastity is no more a virtue than malnutrition. -- Alex Comfort To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message