From owner-cvs-src@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jun 20 21:12:35 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: cvs-src@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CC2016A4CE; Sun, 20 Jun 2004 21:12:35 +0000 (GMT) Received: from pooker.samsco.org (pooker.samsco.org [168.103.85.57]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E1D543D2D; Sun, 20 Jun 2004 21:12:34 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scottl@freebsd.org) Received: from freebsd.org (junior-wifi.samsco.home [192.168.0.11]) (authenticated bits=0) by pooker.samsco.org (8.12.11/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i5KLFZei031300; Sun, 20 Jun 2004 15:15:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from scottl@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <40D5FD8B.7070407@freebsd.org> Date: Sun, 20 Jun 2004 15:11:39 -0600 From: Scott Long User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040304 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "M. Warner Losh" References: <7071.208.178.23.220.1087509793.squirrel@208.178.23.220> <20040618063319.GB17749@electra.cse.Buffalo.EDU> <20040618014912.O72823@odysseus.silby.com> <20040618.094554.06947940.imp@bsdimp.com> In-Reply-To: <20040618.094554.06947940.imp@bsdimp.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=3.8 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on pooker.samsco.org cc: src-committers@freebsd.org cc: cvs-src@freebsd.org cc: silby@silby.com cc: alfred@freebsd.org cc: cvs-all@freebsd.org cc: kensmith@cse.Buffalo.EDU cc: fjoe@samodelkin.net Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/sys/sys mbuf.h src/sys/kern uipc_mbuf.cuipc_syscalls.c src/usr.bin/netstat mbuf.c src/lib/libc/sys sendfile.2 X-BeenThere: cvs-src@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: CVS commit messages for the src tree List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 20 Jun 2004 21:12:35 -0000 M. Warner Losh wrote: > In message: <20040618014912.O72823@odysseus.silby.com> > Mike Silbersack writes: > : My opinion is based on the fact that software in contrib/ and in ports/ > : can change greatly from version to version, yet I'm getting attacked > : because I added a few lines of extra information to a utility. > > Something else changed, therefore all change is fair game is not > logical. You are arguing to be right, rather than arguing for what's > right for the project. This little change isn't worth the push back > you are giving to the folks that rightly point out that it changes > things in -stable more than is traditional. > > Warner Stability in 4-STABLE has been pretty fast and loose over the years. Most of this is because 5-STABLE has been so long in coming, so I don't blame the changes that have happened. HOWEVER.... I plan to start enforcing kernel and userland API and ABI stability once 5-STABLE happens. This _doesn't_ mean that the branch will be locked down and that it's time for everyone to go off in a huff and claim that they won't be able to fix bugs. What it _does_ mean is that changes that affect API/ABI stability and/or user experience will need some form of justification. That justification might include POSIX compliance, security vulnerability, etc. Adding to the API via added library functions, new optional program flags, etc, will pretty much be fair game. The point is that there will be a little more review and oversight going on so that 5-STABLE can actually be advertised as being 'stable'. Along with that, the 6-CURRENT cycle is going to be defined so that it doesn't take 5 years like the 5-CURRENT cycle. These are things that will be heavily discussed at the DevSummit, so I encourage those with an opinion on this to participate in that. Scott