From owner-freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Wed Feb 27 17:04:42 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 438B115225F1 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 17:04:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew.ahrens@delphix.com) Received: from mail-vk1-xa42.google.com (mail-vk1-xa42.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a42]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2F37686AD1 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 17:04:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew.ahrens@delphix.com) Received: by mail-vk1-xa42.google.com with SMTP id l136so4033932vke.2 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 09:04:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=delphix.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=dzhYxylufNQJRJm2kpmXPBpKmouEU15RK8I0LYAsYtQ=; b=EVrsFOv0EmrwE0kngmtuuPUo3HabxH4TVZGr/ZAE+kTWlvyN8t7hIPkjmYna49CIk6 5XGkFaMSmv/1hzqo993Ie/sMrOseoD4UhwvaBgRNDwUvGdimjBLlqsOydIMdH3hKQuFU CHsb6dQIUSP0FNVJ2a9sSMpZF9Rf8o1VIIRus= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=dzhYxylufNQJRJm2kpmXPBpKmouEU15RK8I0LYAsYtQ=; b=Majpzs6FBcXWpLYTQWG7YOmu6GCW6RKau9gqK70B1n8UlPccajNsnvschYc3w5Y9jz zZFH2sHsc4wPlg2wttr8FmrNc+u77V8oA0B5RnhC81eCyvkMkzFnblDnmnGNdhgCFcKE v0cMXHDBy/HiWSQPgoTSROdYF/WS13U+cAmISUkSP+E/nsS2osck9G0eQcSTbH35CbDo B327YNZphKc/baWZ7dDuk6jyHLZso2mHfOe+rf5yOlFebyEJXiYtFO79tVSZGcVp4zpC Vib23EidNhiWUg9ZoGTtQjJVJUABwc4ql7WYomrTqvJzFUx035JWQXuAqMoTckDSV5Eu r4GQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAua09Vx2n6IAwdlBHjnfx2lQf0QdfmpzLs+eifO32jTQ4wHBk4J5 IWIne4OLdwR3SfpmhEZBbthPNW2Mx3mvXXm6p8ZQeA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYkbhh2CMAZy7uk+TwExm5H7oeLstVDGaGH2Lju1ccZ5IzJR7OSQS9WgQYPyOjYm3sk6gS4Z29nV49/5Iaxxu4= X-Received: by 2002:a1f:84c4:: with SMTP id g187mr1225557vkd.47.1551287080115; Wed, 27 Feb 2019 09:04:40 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Matthew Ahrens Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2019 09:04:27 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: February OpenZFS Leadership Meeting To: developer , illumos-zfs , zfs-devel@list.zfsonlinux.org, zfs-devel@freebsd.org, freebsd-fs , zfs-discuss X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 2F37686AD1 X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=delphix.com header.s=google header.b=EVrsFOv0; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=delphix.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of matthew.ahrens@delphix.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::a42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=matthew.ahrens@delphix.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.45 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[delphix.com:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-fs@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[delphix.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[alt1.aspmx.l.google.com,aspmx.l.google.com,aspmx2.googlemail.com,alt2.aspmx.l.google.com,aspmx3.googlemail.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2.4.a.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.15)[-0.148,0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[delphix.com,none]; IP_SCORE(-0.59)[ip: (1.79), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.68), asn: 15169(-2.01), country: US(-0.07)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[mahrens@delphix.com,matthew.ahrens@delphix.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[mahrens@delphix.com,matthew.ahrens@delphix.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2019 17:04:42 -0000 At this meeting we discussed: - who will review Fast Clone Deletion - FIPS 140-2 certification - making compressed ARC mandatory - platform-specific 'sharenfs' property video recording available: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DEXstK9ckcZQ meeting notes (thanks Karyn!): - Reviewers for fast clone deletion (ZoL PR ; illumos PR ) (Sara) - There is a feature flag change that Sara sent email out about. - Sara is seeking reviewers. - Brian volunteered to review, initial pass looks great - How much review is needed? - Will have some conflicts with bpobj iteration work. - BB: Wasn=E2=80=99t planning to get this in before 0.8, but if it woul= d be useful it is possible. - Let=E2=80=99s get it in right after 0.8 (which is due out in March= ) - There are a few fixes that are pending for 0.8 to go out. Matt will look at them! - FIPS 140-2 certification (Luke) - Defense contractors could use ZFS for many things, but require FIPS. Other industries (e.g., healthcare) also have this requirement. - JC: Can you get certification for a source or is it a specific binary build? - Rainbow: It is for specific binary builds, and she does a lot of compliance and can help here. You can do source code level certification. - sef: It is really expensive and time consuming. Level of configuration for testing and certification is super specific. - BB: We do have binaries from companies like RHEL, but they aren=E2= =80=99t official builds.=E2=80=9CFIPS verified=E2=80=9D rather than certif= ied? We=E2=80=99re already using the appropriate crypto algorithm. - PD: Certifying at the source level makes it easier for a vendor to get certified. There are some additional components that would probably need to be looked at (like hash algorithms). - MA: Certification applies to the crypto algorithm. Does that help us since it is a separate module. - AJ: Different Linux distros will have different binaries that would need to be certified separately. - Luke can connect with Rainbow and sef to see what would need to be done to see if it is viable. - Should compressed ARC be mandatory? (Issue ) (Allan J) - Does anyone turn off compressed ARC? If not, we can avoid special cases for this. - Please let Allan know right away if you do turn off compressed ARC. Else that functionality may just be taken out. - MA: Seems like there are some cases on Linux where we can be confident that people aren=E2=80=99t using this combination (i.e.,= it doesn=E2=80=99t work), but that doesn=E2=80=99t cover all cases. - AJ: The crypto changes definitely made it different than what was in FreeBSD. - JC: FWIW, compressed ARC makes ARC better in many different ways in Postgres (at least). They haven=E2=80=99t noticed any latency i= ncreases or memory overhead that has been called out. - AM: It is pretty pointless to disable compressed ARC. The difference when you disable it and use other mechanisms (e.g., bcopy), is negligible and there are other benefits to keep it on. - Please comment in github! - There was no significant negative feedback, so we plan to move forward with making compressed ARC mandatory. - Platform-specific sharenfs (George) - Sent this out the proposal last night. - Create platform-specific properties. These platform-specific properties won=E2=80=99t take effect when importing the pool on a dif= ferent platform. - MA: =E2=80=98sharenfs=E2=80=99 is a system property because ZFS ta= kes action based on it (e.g. share/unshare when you do =E2=80=98zfs rename=E2=80=99= ). It should be platform-specific because the value of the property isn=E2=80=99t verified/interpreted by ZFS - it=E2=80=99s passed to the OS-specif= ic share utility without modification. - AJ: Cross-OS import is a feature I=E2=80=99d like to keep as a 1st= class citizen. - MA: JC provided feedback on the proposal. Please talk about your counter-proposal. - JC: Biggest difference was to keep the functionality the same if people really want it, but there would be a =E2=80=9Cveneer=E2=80= =9D interface that would allow platform-specific properties. Generally people would just us= e whatever properties on their OS. Garrett=E2=80=99s comments are an appliance-centric view. The key bit of the proposal is to ensure that it isn=E2=80=99t dangerous to import onto a different platform. The better eventual solution is to actually do something good in this scenario. - AJ: What about namespacing the property like we do for the user properties: sharenfs:illumos. Maybe make it more feature flag. Do it in a way that is consistent with what is already done. - CS: bikeshed: org.openzfs.illumos:sharenfs - RE: There could be many different iSCSI servers, and would need to figure out how to get to the right one. Some sharing is cross-OS: samba, nfs-ganesha - AJ: share@samba, share@nfs-ganesha, share@illumos=E2=80=A6 -- Tie = this to the server rather than OS? - JC/GW: Maybe a =E2=80=9C.=E2=80=9D instead of =E2=80=9C@=E2=80=9D? - sef: Who is going to decide if this is an OS-specific property? - CS: Have some hooks into a layer (e.g., via lua) rather than having this built into zfs. - MA: Seems like George=E2=80=99s proposal is better than what we have = now, but we should get feedback from various platform vendors. On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 10:53 AM Matthew Ahrens wrote= : > The next OpenZFS Leadership meeting will be held tomorrow, February 26, > 1pm-2pm Pacific time. *Note we are back to the usual time for this > meeting!* > > Everyone is welcome to attend and participate, and we will try to keep th= e > meeting on agenda and on time. The meetings will be held online via Zoom= , > and recorded and posted to the website and YouTube after the meeting. > > The agenda for the meeting will be a discussion of the projects listed in > the agenda doc. > > For more information and details on how to attend, as well as notes and > video from the previous meeting, please see the agenda document: > > > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1w2jv2XVYFmBVvG1EGf-9A5HBVsjAYoLIFZAnW= HhV-BM/edit > > --matt >