From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Sep 11 14:39:20 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0211106566B for ; Tue, 11 Sep 2012 14:39:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-yw0-f44.google.com (mail-yw0-f44.google.com [209.85.213.44]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 787588FC0A for ; Tue, 11 Sep 2012 14:39:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: by yhq56 with SMTP id 56so90310yhq.17 for ; Tue, 11 Sep 2012 07:39:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=sender:subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer :x-gm-message-state; bh=2CyXyXqEX6C1vVtcHBJ3sCKsmZlyhqzUWHTJ5SKHI7M=; b=AQd/zfWjBxr1VjWFQdsaI6IGLrdHyX5OovPGEetDSozctGjVJ/Jco/Hy9v5WI0uQWr gk8W0synXLwroiFPseAL6h610zLWuKqWnjxpeIXaEblkXaZTe4qunOJFV8/PBoYh0xR+ hFjkhjzeCwOJTR/O9cmYI3Na0UhZxK6qCD24m2Xb2Z6z3qV6g077XyZAHJjifqsbnjcd sSmuhgXcPpivSSWlxYjEK+yZz7FWopY6Wy0PVPq1+jLU7+S3ExfUyveH4rokIK2wstLa lp+hV2t92njXiviBL+2p0qcRvqiFyq6N19kRCG9ERZvG0/H/eVd2wImA45O++Hp3S6W9 2WSQ== Received: by 10.236.200.167 with SMTP id z27mr15887349yhn.131.1347374353441; Tue, 11 Sep 2012 07:39:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.12.167] (rrcs-98-100-103-4.central.biz.rr.com. [98.100.103.4]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id x4sm30285263yhh.2.2012.09.11.07.39.10 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 11 Sep 2012 07:39:11 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Warner Losh Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Warner Losh In-Reply-To: <504E3915.6010004@FreeBSD.org> Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2012 09:38:34 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <6497E1D9-6029-4712-8B84-BA2677D39473@bsdimp.com> References: <20120908234659.GA10489@server.rulingia.com> <42D7F0F3-46EC-484A-8665-626AD5D0404E@bsdimp.com> <504D2BE4.6030007@FreeBSD.org> <59550073-A4DE-4152-B406-DFC47AF991DC@bsdimp.com> <504D6EE8.5010604@FreeBSD.org> <7470815C-E215-4A57-90AB-773C2B74E2DA@bsdimp.com> <504E30A9.6030905@FreeBSD.org> <66F37598-323F-48E4-B013-093E6893D05F@bsdimp.com> <504E3915.6010004@FreeBSD.org> To: Doug Barton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnHA4LphjhcaavSBFtnOS4/QWqNww8pOc6QFGvzbhZpT5wYkJPS5r0m5n2QbPPSX2vwfHuX Cc: Eitan Adler , arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Removing CVS from HEAD X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2012 14:39:20 -0000 On Sep 10, 2012, at 2:01 PM, Doug Barton wrote: > On 9/10/2012 11:49 AM, Warner Losh wrote: >>=20 >> On Sep 10, 2012, at 1:25 PM, Doug Barton wrote: >>=20 >>> On 9/10/2012 8:28 AM, Warner Losh wrote: >>>> If all goes according to plan, this will be in a few months. If it = doesn't, then we have a fallback... >>>=20 >>> We already have a fallback, install it from the port. Can you please >>> address why you believe that solution is not adequate? >>=20 >> Because the documentation that we have doesn't say install the port. = It still says use CVS. Once that's updated and translated, that will be = one of the last (last?) thing we need to have things fully cut over and = have cvs really be unused and can then proceed to remove it. >=20 > We're still ripping out places in the docs where we refer to CVS for = src > related stuff, never mind docs and ports. > http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/240316 Should we go back to = using > CVS as the repo until that work is finished? No, we should finish that work as well. The number of people affected = is smaller. And that work should also have been done before the trigger = was pulled. The trigger hasn't been pulled yet on this change. > And as someone else pointed out the average user doesn't use CVS > directly anyway. They use c[v]sup to check out the source, which = doesn't > use anything from the in-base CVS. You'd be surprised how many people use cvsup to get the CVS tree and = then checkout from there. More folks than use the docs tree, I'd wager. > That said, I agree that it's unfortunate that our documentation is so > far behind the curve here, and wish that people would take me more > seriously when I talk about needing a project plan for these kinds of > major infrastructure changes. But just like the mirror creation = process, > the documentation changes are already underway. The sooner we remove = CVS > from the base the sooner we can find other areas that need to be fixed > up, in anticipation of having it polished for 10.0-RELEASE. We should get as much as we can done before pulling the plug, and then = mop up as much as possible from there. Warner