From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Sep 23 20:59:28 2009 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3399810656C2 for ; Wed, 23 Sep 2009 20:59:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peterjeremy@acm.org) Received: from fallbackmx09.syd.optusnet.com.au (fallbackmx09.syd.optusnet.com.au [211.29.132.242]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02FDF8FC20 for ; Wed, 23 Sep 2009 20:59:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail11.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail11.syd.optusnet.com.au [211.29.132.192]) by fallbackmx09.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id n8NIwN7W015875 for ; Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:58:23 +1000 Received: from server.vk2pj.dyndns.org (c122-106-250-30.belrs3.nsw.optusnet.com.au [122.106.250.30]) by mail11.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id n8NIwHln024319 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:58:19 +1000 X-Bogosity: Ham, spamicity=0.000000 Received: from server.vk2pj.dyndns.org (localhost.vk2pj.dyndns.org [127.0.0.1]) by server.vk2pj.dyndns.org (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id n8NIwGgf032540; Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:58:16 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from peter@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org) Received: (from peter@localhost) by server.vk2pj.dyndns.org (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id n8NIwGT6032539; Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:58:16 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from peter) Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:58:16 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy To: "Svein Skogen (listmail account)" Message-ID: <20090923185816.GB26192@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> References: <20090921112657.GW95398@hoeg.nl> <20090922135435.36a3d40e@lazybytes.org> <864oqu1urm.fsf@ds4.des.no> <20090923132036.57767deb@lazybytes.org> <4AB9EAE7.6090108@stillbilde.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="wzJLGUyc3ArbnUjN" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4AB9EAE7.6090108@stillbilde.net> X-PGP-Key: http://members.optusnet.com.au/peterjeremy/pubkey.asc User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14) Cc: arch@freebsd.org, Sergey Vinogradov , current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: tmux(1) in base X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 20:59:28 -0000 --wzJLGUyc3ArbnUjN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm particurly impressed at the striped red and blue paint that has been liberally applied to the shed. On 2009-Sep-23 11:31:19 +0200, "Svein Skogen (listmail account)" wrote: >Sergey Vinogradov wrote: >> don't propose zsh(1) replacing sh(1). I just think it would be handy to >> have zsh(1) in the base system. Not replacing sh(1), but as one >> more piece of software. I personally use zsh as my interactive shell but I don't think it belongs in the base system. IMHO, the base system only needs a single, POSIX-compliant shell - so it is already over-endowed. >Wouldn't that bring back (among others) perl into the base? I seem to >remember there was some effort spent on removing that a while ago... There were two main reasons for removing perl: 1) Perl was undergoing rapid development at a rate that was not compatible with the FreeBSD release schedule - so the base version of perl was out-of-date. 2) The FreeBSD base system must be able to be cross-built (this is needed to support upgrading even within the same architecture). Perl is not intended to be cross-built and the effort involved in shoe-horning it into the buildworld process was becoming too onerous - especially since it needed to be reworked for each new perl release. As for tmux(1) vs screen(1) vs window(1): I don't see any compelling reason for any of these to belong in the base system. (And, if you rely solely on the pkg-descr for those tools, there doesn't appear to be any need for those tools at all unless you are using a real glass TTY on a headless system. Talking to people who use them, it appears that the only useful feature in screen/tmux isn't mentioned in the pkg-descr). --=20 Peter Jeremy --wzJLGUyc3ArbnUjN Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.13 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkq6b8gACgkQ/opHv/APuIdTFACfcLXWLkeBnwUMd0mC7TCWIUb1 nvsAn39vpjwAncSb3jAbqdmUQvr6GtLj =rAL1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --wzJLGUyc3ArbnUjN--