From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Thu Dec 1 23:37:58 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1758C61C61; Thu, 1 Dec 2016 23:37:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from woodsb02@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io0-x230.google.com (mail-io0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c06::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9C10F1299; Thu, 1 Dec 2016 23:37:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from woodsb02@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io0-x230.google.com with SMTP id j65so453604979iof.0; Thu, 01 Dec 2016 15:37:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=WwPVqhaWWd3jNmYH7zlw0INNS+ICkfh2JV3tYbEtytY=; b=SfxY5lxK12sJjRi8lh+wSWXf3OybGaBnhbJnkvGGK44C3qnADlnjf1vqvc57SQT9Zp ufXMu1FQDdVn5VNIeVsfWcKB/m4IWaqS4CecMxOkpZZwXe/MJ+XuIIluLfjnXLkLSx7+ i6yWwj/9zD4C9paU/NYWp13K9QJoX50/saKPBF2RuVqOAWiJA8gyF78lPooRb4hxbida W8eiJ2+VyhkmwnD7oe1wRLuQm+9HBgARln9BN+wbi15RobwlbDuwiS0MWG6oqiE7VKDl 7eTRuPAWksv3b9Kq9qr690VGB7HVAWFnHlF2p4L00Q7hDEERswebGKFP8O2vyzd66sfD +Vqw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=WwPVqhaWWd3jNmYH7zlw0INNS+ICkfh2JV3tYbEtytY=; b=OSg86rXozZv53Pj8Tp/2/pmBV9Tx5Snn23U3xWkB9pk0By8+i89BqZdkfR4ZpCg9Y6 xleea6Xv/OtcfVYC+6IEfC+HlgnzbjUz6wB3ylyfp49/hVkcKi16EZRlHXuFFNNF5r3K vTcUO65DkRy1r0Qqr3OastfytciUMf3wu5X8TxlbAdj9xLmwCh5Vl6Rbow1arbpSVQuB +Rvn5G+pgN0HeK/QCljKgj4ZnF/nInId0d+hex4v7M+xrh3PLnR+KemrYbH33JlAv6vu XG5SPk9RmOjtgu1swAnfElQIxTc95cUD2RNPPBVCzVBDHy+WGTJ5Y8YLzLfElPyDZoXh 18bQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AKaTC01ypKzn0hDvyu8GsamAramMpwIxZ7LWNjxKxc232V3dXpI/U+hazcg/maBdu8/mTUvWNYlfpLsykRhZ7Q== X-Received: by 10.36.58.85 with SMTP id m82mr287705itm.29.1480635477486; Thu, 01 Dec 2016 15:37:57 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <158bc7db990.e5ab7400189889.2067341649206744373@nextbsd.org> In-Reply-To: <158bc7db990.e5ab7400189889.2067341649206744373@nextbsd.org> From: Ben Woods Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2016 23:37:46 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: drm-next update and longer term plans To: Matthew Macy , "freebsd-current@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-x11@freebsd.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.23 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2016 23:37:58 -0000 On Fri., 2 Dec. 2016 at 6:25 am, Matthew Macy wrote: > I imagine that for most users the state of graphics support for > post-Haswell hardware is a bit of a black box so I'm sending out this note > to let users know what they can and cannot expect. > > Wayland has actually become a reality for some. Talk to Johannes Lundberg > if you're interested in tracking that. > > The i915 (Intel integrated GPUs) driver is currently best supported by the > drm-next-4.7 branch. Broadwell and Skylake support is complete and some > support came in late in the cycle for Kaby Lake. I can still consistently > lock up the kernel in the later stages of the piglit test suite, there is > no backlight support, and suspend/resume do not work on Skylake. The > drm-next branch is integrated with upstream up through Linux 4.8-rc5 and > thus has complete support for Kaby Lake, but there is a lockup in i915 that > occurs some time within an hour of startx. This takes too long for it to > have shown up in my limited integration smoke testing. > > The amdgpu driver is, in terms of KPI dependencies - as far as I can tell > - a strict superset of the radeon driver. For example, when I tested my one > older card that uses the radeon driver it manifested the same ttm bugs as > amdgpu did at that time. Thus, when amdgpu reaches a complete working state > I expect radeon to largely "just" work. As of this past Sunday amdgpu with > the amdgpu DDX works with 2D, supports external monitors - selecting the > appropriate resolution on a per display basis, and backlight works. It will > also typically panic in ttm within ~90 minutes of startx. Although this is > huge progress over panicking within 30s of startx (which was the case as of > Saturday) or not starting at all due to bugs in the libdrm port a few weeks > prior, it's obviously not something I encourage anyone to use. > > My primary motivation for starting with the work is being able to to train > DNNs/RNNs and other model types using Theano/Caffe/Tensorflow/BidMach etc > GPU accelerated whilst still running FreeBSD. The Radeon Open Compute stack > holds out the promise of doing that without using the closed source CUDA > stack on top of the Linux ABI emulation - which would inevitably be opaque > and fragile. My plan is to keep on fixing bugs and tracking upstream until > the first long term branch after ROC support has been integrated in to > Linux mainline. I have no exact knowledge of when exactly that will be (AMD > doesn't have sufficient developer resources to make any concrete > guarantees) but think it should happen by the summer of 2017. I would like > to think that by that time the i915, amdgpu, and radeon will be feature > complete and at least as stable as the drm2 support currently in tree. > > I need to weigh my soft commitment to make long-term DRM support happen > with paid work and other activities which are much more important to me > long term. Thus I've currently committed to spending every Sunday fixing > bugs in the drm-next branches. Amdgpu is both more important to me and has > gotten much less attention than i915. Thus I will be devoting my efforts to > it in the near term. I'd very much welcome efforts by others to triage the > issues in i915. > > Many people ask when drm-next will be available on 11. I am not a > committer and thus have no direct say in that. However, if you are a > motivated individual with kernel knowledge you should contact Adrian Chadd. > There are a few places where I was not able to provide proper linuxkpi > semantics without making (mostly quite modest) changes to sys/kern. There > is a general reluctance by some core developers to make changes to > accommodate Linux. It is possible that, with additional effort, the > linuxkpi can both be complete enough to avoid needing to port the graphics > drivers to FreeBSD (something clearly shown by past efforts to be > unsustainable) and not need to make any kernel changes. If you would like > to help with that, let Adrian know. In the meantime, TrueOS will continue > to use my development branches for the benefit of users with newer hardware. > > -M > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-x11@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-x11 > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-x11-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > Hi Matthew / others, Thanks for your work - I sincerely appreciate every minute of your personal time spent on this. What are your thoughts on whether this is ready for committing to 12-current, with plenty of time for polishing before it makes it into a release? Regards, Ben