From owner-freebsd-emulation@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Apr 17 07:05:32 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-emulation@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45C281065677 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2008 07:05:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from alexander@leidinger.net) Received: from redbull.bpaserver.net (redbullneu.bpaserver.net [213.198.78.217]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BA928FC33 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2008 07:05:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from alexander@leidinger.net) Received: from outgoing.leidinger.net (p54A573DE.dip.t-dialin.net [84.165.115.222]) by redbull.bpaserver.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C49B32E0D6; Thu, 17 Apr 2008 09:05:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from webmail.leidinger.net (webmail.leidinger.net [192.168.1.102]) by outgoing.leidinger.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 332298C29D; Thu, 17 Apr 2008 09:05:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from www@localhost) by webmail.leidinger.net (8.14.2/8.13.8/Submit) id m3H75K3L016208; Thu, 17 Apr 2008 09:05:20 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from pslux.cec.eu.int (pslux.cec.eu.int [158.169.9.14]) by webmail.leidinger.net (Horde Framework) with HTTP; Thu, 17 Apr 2008 09:05:20 +0200 Message-ID: <20080417090520.10531aih8m18dku8@webmail.leidinger.net> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2008 09:05:20 +0200 From: Alexander Leidinger To: Boris Samorodov References: <72854627@bb.ipt.ru> <20080416064556.GA1095@medusa.sysfault.org> <15612262@bb.ipt.ru> <20080416152407.GD1074@medusa.sysfault.org> <20080416175922.14575iy6l8u8cqo0@webmail.leidinger.net> <72736263@bb.ipt.ru> In-Reply-To: <72736263@bb.ipt.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.2-RC2) / FreeBSD-8.0 X-BPAnet-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-BPAnet-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-BPAnet-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, ORDB-RBL, SpamAssassin (not cached, score=-14.004, required 6, BAYES_00 -15.00, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE 1.40, RDNS_DYNAMIC 0.10, SMILEY -0.50) X-BPAnet-MailScanner-From: alexander@leidinger.net X-Spam-Status: No Cc: freebsd-emulation@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CALL FOR TESTERS: linux-f8 infrastructure ports X-BeenThere: freebsd-emulation@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Development of Emulators of other operating systems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2008 07:05:32 -0000 Quoting Boris Samorodov (from Wed, 16 Apr 2008 21:27:36 +0400)= : > On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 17:59:22 +0200 Alexander Leidinger wrote: >> Quoting Marcus von Appen (from Wed, 16 Apr 2008 >> 17:24:07 +0200): >> > On, Wed Apr 16, 2008, Boris Samorodov wrote: > >> >> Do you by any chance use nvidia card and WITH_NVIDIA=3DYES variable? >> >> I myself can't use google-earth because it segfaults while it >> >> is reported to work fine for other users. >> > >> > Yes, I do use a nvidia card. Sorry for mnot mentioning that :-). >> > Maybe some issue with the libglu/libgl linux ports? > >> Hardware accelerated 3D does not work ATM. We need someone looking >> into updating the corresponding linux port in a suitable way. AFAIR >> this involves taking some source, massaging it somehow, compiling it >> on linux and then making a tarball. Any chance you volunteer to have a >> look into this? Nobody else is doing this ATM. > > First of, I totally agree with you, Alexander. > > But, second, do you mean that it's the case (that an updated port > may help Marcus)? You didn't _say_ so but did you assume it? ;-) My message was a little bit short, as my GF was waiting for me to go out. :) > My point of view is that those ports which use nvidia drivers > should work as is. I.e. if I have installed nvidia drivers built > with linux support and install a port (say, astro/google-earth) > using apropriate variable (WITH_NVIDIA_GL=3DYES for google-earth) > then the port sould work. If it doesn't then it's a bug either > at nvidia driver or at our linuxulator (or more wide). There's a little bit more involved here. Unfortunately I don't have =20 the necessary knowledge to give a full technical explanation. The 3D =20 world in X11 as I see it in this case is as follows. The native X server is doing the 3D stuff. The application connects to =20 it and tells do to some 3D (indirect rendering, most probably not =20 hardware accelerated). This is done in a high level standard way and =20 as such does not cause a problem. With the NVidia GL libs on the other hand, there's some kind of bypass =20 of the X server after the 3D setup (direct rendering, AFAIK always =20 hardware accelerated, at least partially). NVidia is a little bit =20 special, as it does it's own direct rendering stuff, not the official =20 DRI. But AFAIK some parts of the linux-dri port _may_ be used. The =20 linux-dri port is specially crafted for FreeBSD as described in my =20 previous mail. With the new X.org version there may be some changes =20 needed. The troublesome part in general, and not directly related to NVidia =20 is, that the DRI stuff has undergone several revisions which need to =20 be taken care of in the 3D stuff. As far as I remember, the revision =20 in our kernel changed at some point (but is far away from being on the =20 same level than the DRI stuff in linux), but the corresponding linux =20 port was not updated. So we have a version mismatch in the linux-dri =20 port and we don't get hardware accelerated 3D in linux. Anholt@ should =20 know more about it, but he puts more energy into X.org stuff than into =20 FreeBSD, so I don't expect that we will see some work from him there =20 soon (I haven't asked him, shame on me). The easy solution would be to take the sources and fix it for the =20 current stuff. The person doing this should contact Anholt, he should =20 know a little bit more about it and maybe he has a little bit of time =20 to explain some things (if the person wants to provide some notes in a =20 public place, we can arrange access to the FreeBSD wiki). The ideal solution would be to first have a look at the differences =20 between the linux DRI stuff and the FreeBSD DRI stuff, take =20 appropriate action, and then have a look at the things above (maybe we =20 can use the corresponding stuff from linux directly then). Again, there's a lot of lack of domain specific knowledge on my side, =20 so there may be some errors/inaccuracies in my explanation above. Take =20 it with a grain of salt (corrections welcome). Bye, Alexander. --=20 Life is like a buffet; it's not good but there's plenty of it. http://www.Leidinger.net Alexander @ Leidinger.net: PGP ID =3D B0063FE7 http://www.FreeBSD.org netchild @ FreeBSD.org : PGP ID =3D 72077137