From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Sep 3 10:05:45 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9C7E16A4BF; Wed, 3 Sep 2003 10:05:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cyberonic.com (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 334BB43FD7; Wed, 3 Sep 2003 10:05:44 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (node-40244c0a.sfo.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.76.10]) by mail.cyberonic.com (8.12.8/8.12.5) with ESMTP id h83HnWbi003599; Wed, 3 Sep 2003 13:49:33 -0400 Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.12.9/8.11.6) id h83H5U21048892; Wed, 3 Sep 2003 10:05:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg) Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 10:05:30 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Denis Troshin Message-ID: <20030903170530.GD16766@funkthat.com> Mail-Followup-To: Denis Troshin , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <29508631.20030901165843@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <29508631.20030901165843@mail.ru> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.2-RELEASE i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ X-Resume: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/resume.html cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Ugly Huge BSD Monster X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Sep 2003 17:05:45 -0000 Denis Troshin wrote this message on Mon, Sep 01, 2003 at 16:58 +0700: Sorry for all the responses that don't directly answer your question, but you did ask it in a rather tactless way by saying it's a mess w/o understanding the reasoning behind it. > Almost every package I install requires a few other packages. This > 'idea of using dependent packages' turns FreeBSD (and other > unix-systems) to an ugly monster. This is because the packages are ment to be a one size fits all system. If you want to eliminate some of the dependancies, then you are free to build the port yourself. There is plenty of documentation in the handbook about how the port system works. > For example, I don't need Perl or Python but a few packages I install > require them. This is for the people that do want the perl and/or python extensions that the package provides. The packages are targeted at the widest audience. If you don't need them, then build the port yourself. > Does exist a programming under unix without these dependencies? > > P.S. Under Windows it is possible to write not bad applications which > depend just on libraries (KERNEL32, USER32, GDI32). And these libs > exist on every base system!!! Just like libc, libcrypto, libcurses, libssl, etc. It's just that some of the GNU libraries change too often, and are not used by the base system. As someone else pointed out, you have to have vbrunXXX.dll installed and of the proper version. Many windows installs tell you how/where to download said app. Though windows doesn't let you just run a single command like: pkg_add -r python and automaticly get the program installed. The real problem is the ports software. You need to complain to the authors of the ports for writing the code in this manner. We choose to make the software easier to install so new people don't have to learn as much about configuring and installing software. If you don't like the ports system, we don't for you to use it. You can just go out and build and install all the software by hand. > Is it possible in unix? > > Before I thought that unix programs very compact, but they are huge! They are, it's just some aren't writen to be small. I hope this help you understand. -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 415 225 5579 "All that I will do, has been done, All that I have, has not."