From owner-freebsd-chat Fri Mar 20 12:15:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA14867 for freebsd-chat-outgoing; Fri, 20 Mar 1998 12:15:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from sendero.simon-shapiro.org (sendero-fddi.Simon-Shapiro.ORG [206.190.148.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA14843 for ; Fri, 20 Mar 1998 12:15:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shimon@simon-shapiro.org) Received: (qmail 25386 invoked from network); 20 Mar 1998 20:21:51 -0000 Received: from localhost.simon-shapiro.org (HELO sendero-fxp0.simon-shapiro.org) (@127.0.0.1) by localhost.simon-shapiro.org with SMTP; 20 Mar 1998 20:21:51 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3-alpha-031298 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199803180757.CAA20792@dyson.iquest.net> Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 12:21:51 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: shimon@simon-shapiro.org Organization: The Simon Shapiro Foundation From: Simon Shapiro To: "John S. Dyson" Subject: Re: Sendmail going commercial, and ? Cc: jack@germanium.xtalwind.net, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Sorry for the delay. I was out of town. I think we have nothing to worry about. If my help is needed, let me know. Simon On 18-Mar-98 John S. Dyson wrote: > Simon Shapiro said: >> >> The way I understand the Sendmail announcement, is that new, future, >> versions will be commercially encumbered. What is in our tree is not (I >> cannot see how it could be). >> > I don't see that is necessarily true. There will likely be a > non-commercial > as-is sendmail like today. There will also be a commercial sendmail. > >> >> Now, if we choose to just maintain this code base, we have no problem. >> Sendmail has been around for some decades now and should be pretty >> stable. >> It is safe to assume that new, replacement versions are not essential >> anymore. If we choose to bring in a new, commercial version, then we >> will >> violate many spoken and unspoken rules of this wonderful project. >> > We will not bring in the commercial version, by default, probably even if > it is free for FreeBSD use. People regularly like to hack on *BSD > software, > and additional encumberances just don't fit our model. > >> >> If we find ourselves in a situation where we have to replace sendmail >> with >> unencumbered code, I volunteer to write it. I do not enjoy such work in >> particular, but will do it for the good of the project. I promise to >> make >> the code Berkeley license, before I write the first line. >> >:-). I think that if sendmail does become significantly encumbered, a new > mailer project would be a very good thing. It is likely that such a > project > either being a single person type thing, or a large (Apache) type thing > would > be a good marketing vehicle for whomever is involved. > >> >> So where do you see us stand: >> >> a. No problem at all, business as usual >> b. We only sustain existing sendmail, and defer replacement until the >> code >> athrophies enough (via missing new functionality, or just age) >> c. We want to replace sendmail asap, but have a replacement in mind. >> d. We need to start a new MTA project. >> e. Something else which Simon did not think about. >> > I think that right now, it is best to think in 'a' mode above. 'd' mode > is a good thing, but something that one would want to think very > seriously > about before embarking on. I think that 'b' mode would happen only if > Sendmail does become significantly encumbered. 'c' mode is probably as > problematical as a commercial sendmail. > > Sendmail is the de-facto very (perhaps too) general standard, compared > with > other mailers. I think that we should stick with it as the default until > this thing settles out. Again, if someone had lots of energy, 'd' can't > be a > bad thing. I suspect that if the effort is started, that it might become > commercial, due to the significant effort that the project would entail. > > It seems that MTA replacements are one of those things that suck people > in by their deceptive simplicity. I could be wrong, because I haven't > really looked into MTA's myself (except when having to mess with Sendmail > config files, which I like much less than writing Lex and Yacc programs.) > > Again, the above are only my opinions, and I don't have any interest > in dissuading a new MTA project. I do think that we are due for a new > (less general, but easier to configure and simpler) one, but I also don't > think that Sendmail will be going the way of the evil empire. If it > does, > the problem will be solved, and I suspect that if you are interested, > you and others interested in it would participate in or spearhead such > an effort. The results of that effort could be adopted by all of the > Free OSes (kind-of like Apache.) > > (Again, the above opinions are mine, and not necessarily that of -core.) > > -- > John | Never try to teach a pig to sing, > dyson@freebsd.org | it just makes you look stupid, > jdyson@nc.com | and it irritates the pig. ---------- Sincerely Yours, Simon Shapiro Shimon@Simon-Shapiro.ORG Voice: 503.799.2313 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message