From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Wed Jul 20 19:08:45 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE644B9F77D for ; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 19:08:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from baptiste.daroussin@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm0-x244.google.com (mail-wm0-x244.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::244]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4FB8515FC; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 19:08:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from baptiste.daroussin@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wm0-x244.google.com with SMTP id i5so8333350wmg.2; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 12:08:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:date:from:to:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=i/SUa7JTQUeKxIBFWxkRxWfEaT8ymO48DRChHgK0Z0w=; b=G4pEP1pkdPvZ69RJTDj/J2szVILoWl7Wtl42Ql+YJ4L9MG7cl9X2n78ohFdh78vv0S OJoTOk5yOkg5qIlQ7visJOFUVaMIAdIxunH7ruYkG8WVvwHkfUpONvcS1/2LHdNv7NJG GbYy4QJ3qkHW2z+yXDVwWQAK/aEY3bQTUBZSNCkICVRYwBp/UPqFUZc4qhQQtBmnL5bj dtrR/yY6wcx5gY1wgGdAd2ruyva5FV7jjXKSSvb9C1tl78bEK6bA8IWRY3lPGyFV6lH0 K4hKnCFINLltwuegshvltPy7U2IZUvRO3NMI2DaX16E7JdlR3Fq7Tjvu4CURbPcXIcM3 /zRg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:date:from:to:subject:message-id :references:mime-version:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=i/SUa7JTQUeKxIBFWxkRxWfEaT8ymO48DRChHgK0Z0w=; b=G9FZaklqG118XD7aWpKwkBScIIN0UJepePDyTzzkN7NkBToNNFa90EGs2IHIPjDm6g o8zqXJpDtxEXQpPkYNaJnKcPSKaJmYsB/ZD844e2PdAma15RfcJRZFrhlDQoMnoVmCw0 kUYyfnr3UDLuuYJcB0dvJukNYcEp+OrX+jLFw5To3UkstvyG0tD2hrk7YPx4FIHRRYu+ N4MaqQs1ew4ZhmjImQf0BhcmohsyePzi6IhOJ1F1CHlKeRMxUW4fOvoRzRZ0if9YbrKb 0Ah6+Wy3jZUttnsv4L0cl0BbWTouRcZbSQ2nMMdnRtKQ/l6FvqmJXh55+yqyVjYylb0A RwgQ== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tJul6ULy6L1nfxcEe5wc+xkkgCUjOgbnS54FVHLttqcmCk5WPePUC05gJ8lpp4dzA== X-Received: by 10.28.104.137 with SMTP id d131mr13442719wmc.7.1469041723310; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 12:08:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ivaldir.etoilebsd.net ([2001:41d0:8:db4c::1]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id m81sm32823529wmf.1.2016.07.20.12.08.41 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 20 Jul 2016 12:08:42 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Baptiste Daroussin Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2016 21:08:41 +0200 From: Baptiste Daroussin To: Jonathan Anderson , Tim =?utf-8?Q?=C4=8Cas?= , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: UTF-8 by default? Message-ID: <20160720190841.iuplrbhmdq7sr6br@ivaldir.etoilebsd.net> References: <20160720140741.yi7vfgmmqtg6eprx@ivaldir.etoilebsd.net> <20160720183814.GA77261@ymer.vnode.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="eyp6ncyn5hgcup43" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20160720183814.GA77261@ymer.vnode.se> User-Agent: Mutt/1.6.1-neo (2016-06-11) X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2016 19:08:45 -0000 --eyp6ncyn5hgcup43 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 08:38:14PM +0200, Joel Dahl wrote: > On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 04:07:41PM +0200, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > > On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 10:47:45AM -0230, Jonathan Anderson wrote: > > > On 20 Jul 2016, at 9:13, Tim =C4=8Cas wrote: > > >=20 > > > > So, without further ado: > > > > 1) What are the reasons that UTF-8 isn't the default yet? > > > > 2) Would it be possible to make this the default in 11.0? What about > > > > 12.0? > > > > 3) Assuming an effort is started towards making UTF-8 the default, > > > > what changes would be required? > > >=20 > > > At least according to one of my students (who makes more extensive us= e of > > > i18n than I do), enabling UTF-8 by default is pretty straightforward: > > >=20 > > > https://github.com/musec/freebsd/wiki/Common-setup#utf-8-support > >=20 > > the LC_COLLATE=3DC is not needed anymore with freebsd 11+ > > >=20 > > > If there's anything missing there, I'd love to hear about it. > > >=20 > > - unicode support in our old groff is pretty bad, I plan to replace i= t with > > heirloom-doctools which does handle unicode propertly (as far I hav= e tested > > at least) >=20 > I haven't really been paying attention lately so things might have change= d, > but why can't we just remove groff now? We have mdocml, and for people th= at > really need the groff functionality can just install it or heirloom-docto= ols > from ports. The initial plan was to remove groff after we imported mdocml= , but > it was never removed and I lost interest, so again, things might have cha= nged > since then. We have roff documentation in based, plus a lot of people argues that not h= avin a roff toolchain in base is an issue for them. heirloom doctools upstream is friendly, they fixed all the bugs I reported = or merged my fixes if needed, they have a good compatibility so the fallback in man(1) could be done on something in base if mandoc cannot render properly = some manpages. Upstream is CDDL but all new code is BSD licensed. Importing is not hard, just need some motivation to finish all the required makefiles :) Best regards, Bapt --eyp6ncyn5hgcup43 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJXj8wwAAoJEGOJi9zxtz5aJPwP/ilpKXKH10yDINtdbTRbPa2O 5js0jeZopx1lu6+0vN8eksOtNyPBNUPnw/XjipDhOGaAdrk70zoCDN4NjR1Ysnsb acnUFcoLJlNO3OUrTzaCvrYIs4JnD5nZ3dgBc+4cZaTCrzehAWgO2GsFA6fxm2CC 5B4T21E1WlLFiqa06U/HUwxLT2ShZjF1r2D57l/YI9et8cCFpAjLaqPguyCmwbPp S61ymbfmBZ0xiKJ9muy1HZj0AsQgfeUzSwJcvZmdsVCcoAHxy4NrjjuAcy0NRil+ E09XAmgMnKHSEO02ptGHK5P6nVnbO5dZ8BmKnfHjJEXUZWzZr+ojlbH4xLVEJ33T 4gGlql1gUDq50/tP+ss5gZxcirglyu0yWFavyIgezHen4HDRceRbtuK+a9NL93Br oP3MTvx/hZhyMQkpp0pXWShpG6ubjxehG6PthEGach3TEAxr1pjj0jM0abQTPlyK xs9YibvLdYh2M8j38kiCkrBW1hvYWmPHd1jtGawEqTp3RT0T32FlBqPZMZT1SukQ 5CmaSKXd5MTBPv7pUOTtuCRHd2XTdtWg061A8+jkTm+3Eh4lGwU+B5vd8SxA8C4T d6bA7ppsIW0LxeuXNoUJ72lXdqULvBNP4s0Iw3zKMIblNNe1wMNP3+bTSbhwNJ0G F1KCnSbl9uWMplCZrDEq =lxQD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --eyp6ncyn5hgcup43--