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Date:      Wed, 09 Apr 1997 23:33:57 -0400
From:      "Louis A. Mamakos" <louie@TransSys.COM>
To:        Kazutaka YOKOTA <yokota@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp>
Cc:        freebsd-current@freefall.freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: moused enhancement (was: Re: make world) 
Message-ID:  <199704100333.XAA21958@whizzo.transsys.com>
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:36:10 %2B0900." <199704100236.LAA07337@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp> 
References:  <Pine.OSF.3.95q.970407165836.15555A-100000@protocol.eng.umd.edu> <19970409032758.35315@usn.blaze.net.au> <199704091659.MAA19396@whizzo.transsys.com> <199704100236.LAA07337@zodiac.mech.utsunomiya-u.ac.jp> 

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> I looked at your patch (PR bin/3028) and understand that it adds ALPS
> GlidePoint support. XFree86 also has GlidePoint support (since
> 3.1.2F?).  As far as I can understand, your support code and XFree86's
> are not functionally equivalent.

Yes, this seems to be the case.  I had already made similar changes to
this in the X server and moused seems to be the better approach - it
didn't require that I have to figure out how to build X.  

> Yours is for GlidePoint on the PS/2 mouse port and XFree86's code is
> for GlidePoint attached to a serial port. Your code makes `moused'
> pretend the left mouse button is pressed when the user `taps'
> GlidePoint's surface, whereas XFree86 regards the `tap' action as the
> fourth button press.

I was hopeful when I heard about the glidepoint support in XFree86,
but frankly, having the tap gesture appear as a fourth mouse button
didn't solve a problem - it simply created another one.  Frankly,
X already has way too many degrees of freedom and configurability as
a substitute for user interface design, and this was another chrome
plated knob.  

All I wanted was to have the stupid point device *work*;  I lost my
will to dick around with X trying to get CAPS-LOCK/CTRL keys to do
the right thing.  I just wanted it to work..

> Ok, we can argue that it isn't necessary that `moused' and XFree86
> behave in exactly the same way.  But, isn't this difference rather
> confusing to the user? In order for a user to use GlidePoint with X,
> he has to choose:
> 
> 1) attach GlidePoint to the PS/2 mouse port and specify `glidepoint' 
>    to `moused'. Tell X, in XF86Config, to access `/dev/sysmouse' and
>    the protocol is `mousesystems'. 
> 2) attach GlidePoint to a serial port, don't use `moused'. specify 
>    `glidepoint' in XF86Config.
> 
> If GlidePoint is attached to a serial port and the user intends to use
> `moused', he shouldn't specify `glidepoint' as the protocol, rather he
> has to choose `microsoft' or `mouseman'. `Tap' feature won't be
> recognized in this case.

> If GlidePoint is attached to the PS/2 mouse port and the user don't
> use `moused', he shouldn't specify `glidepoint' as the protocol in
> XF86Config, rather he has to say `ps/2'. `Tap' feature won't be
> recognized in this case.
> 
> IMHO, more complete support for GlidePoint is necessary for both
> `moused' and XFree86. One solution on `moused's side may be to
> incorporate serial GlidePoint support code from XFree86 into `moused'. 
> What do you think?

Alternatively, we ought to recommend that moused *always* be used as a
default configuration, and leave one less XF86Config option to worry about.
In that way, you'll get the syscons support along for free.

I claim that having the XFree86 behaviour of a 4th mouse button
doesn't actually help most users.  They just want the pointing device
to do the right thing.  I suppose (eeek!) an option could be added to
configure what the tap gesture should do.

> One other thing.  ALPS produces several models of GlidePoint devices. 
> I know that some models (such as Desktop GlidePoint model GP101) need
> specific support code, but the others (such as GlidePoint model GP001)
> don't; they internally generate a left button press event when the
> user taps the surface of the device.

Certainly the earlier ALPS 3 button devices, including the "standalone"
laptop pointing device and their combined keyboard/pointing device have
a seperate tap gesture.  I haven't encountered the other ones myself.

louie





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