From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Jul 14 15:28:07 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 449D23664E8 for ; Tue, 14 Jul 2020 15:28:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from aryeh.friedman@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io1-xd35.google.com (mail-io1-xd35.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d35]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4B5ktF73LQz3TvW for ; Tue, 14 Jul 2020 15:28:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from aryeh.friedman@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io1-xd35.google.com with SMTP id k23so17664678iom.10 for ; Tue, 14 Jul 2020 08:28:05 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=qoBFcgwrZKQXHyegQEEj+cqedSZcs/DtJSBT1J74z7A=; b=QszBGg2B0UeDnQpv9z5AB4tjburUVGOiFG4t81zDXgfEP7y2f3+5P8xaSdRqPpepof 2gXeaEIwo2QjOip/Uy/DsuS8D2vXQl4k5vrPCWZxvulca2Za5twjv4OF4SuZawAdXV0z kaAbSYkWezlCdhPb6b4yg+VK/u4cF4uO40EHeiP8L7WVaAcYQWkQjxV0RnMZuzL9Z2ef iGLJubboWC4Kbe4vai76KLebPMDtBSqMqxUsbTIw1FIe6Z8fZT7KU54g9kuq4hwi9Jy3 AbU/jbs7FX6zVw4a/5dDwe1QrdYOFsKV2wrKAAETl9UwNfN/R/9IhwonmDrRJl7nif38 7ALw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=qoBFcgwrZKQXHyegQEEj+cqedSZcs/DtJSBT1J74z7A=; b=i9Xj0A/AzeKJQ0FN4ZXHOcnXU5MnBA1Qhu4tZphyNiABMRkOwWEulQjBQZR3zcUzBd DpGr6eyqdv3gBzA3XskIq3jvimcRT5urfdcU+dVW6UyBPkvC0PPtPadtzZMrjAKEzeu6 w1Ish2DEUowAKbtFUUZm5br1tfOAVXhPjp9sZDjHY4b9KcJ6TNswJklTKjaLESi77aGJ PtNh6UR1OKesJ1vNcycYuIe6eExvKCc1NR3nKUJDSNtM/7UQRCGTKT1tLmK09OP2EmuI hWc9cALFVNgmojcEfpmWgrOZPuKTtY8SvDnDnTlYnVIpWhNonpUgb5qxXvEP/yb2uoym Qz4A== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530Xq/SDnWQ8pG3NF/yr++PxsRxI92qFro++cY+JsmJdg7joN5tj Jw46a3Zuek8NFOq6+zDZWtEw8VOMtb3CYjP/lD0rRiWb X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzdmnYz4B5D4FIW604PBP19Kpc/q+qg4ObPnGwd10HgakGS206Hry0gk1BB7hRqucfp72BjGSq31fmgXJhHROs= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6602:2549:: with SMTP id j9mr5278253ioe.89.1594740484247; Tue, 14 Jul 2020 08:28:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <8fcd60d7-1de1-82dc-d840-2555663ac153@gmail.com> <20200714070831.f01a144e1dc808ebea421afe@sohara.org> <20200714104735.ceae71903e2f61bf401655ea@sohara.org> <8f96ee4e-2922-7850-6839-1c50a62094fe@gmail.com> <20200714153626.62ade8ec.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200714151237.GA28670@mithril> In-Reply-To: <20200714151237.GA28670@mithril> From: Aryeh Friedman Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2020 11:27:52 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Petite Cloud, CBSD, Intellij To: FreeBSD Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4B5ktF73LQz3TvW X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=QszBGg2B; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of aryehfriedman@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::d35 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=aryehfriedman@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.84 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.01)[-1.014]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.06)[-1.065]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::d35:from]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.24)[0.244]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.33 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2020 15:28:07 -0000 On Tue, Jul 14, 2020 at 11:13 AM Jacques Foucry wrote: > > > Whew! I was afraid I'd managed to start a *real* flame war, one of > those > > > endless my-language/your-language pissing matches. :D > > > > Don't worry! Experienced programmers _know_ that you can write > > crappy code in _every_ language - it's just the fact the some > > languages encourage writing bad code more than others if the > > programmer did not properly learn the language's elements and > > its adjacent tools. :-) > > And others (like COBOL[1]) are strictly discourage bad/non reading code. > COBOL is the very definition of a language that encourages bad code (assembly is the only one that is worse). One of the worst offending items is a construct (I forget the actual code) that boils down to goto with a symbolic (and changeable at run time) goto. The only thing worse then this when keeping with the unconditional arbitrary instruction pointer changing theme (aka "goto considered harmful") is a hypothetical construct I have joked about I call "dynamic camefrom". Camefrom says to go back to the last location that executed a goto (think of it as an unstructured return/break/continue that can be used between functions and outside of loops). The dynamic camefrom lets you at runtime symbolically specify how many gotos to jump over when going back to where you came from (it is a seg fault/core dump if you specify a number of gotos that is greater then the number executed so far in the program or if it is negative). The icing on the cake would be a purely dynamically typed language that implies type by first assignment (such as JavaShit) implementing dynamic camefroms. -- Aryeh M. Friedman, Lead Developer, http://www.PetiteCloud.org