Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2011 06:28:15 +0100 From: "Svein Skogen (Listmail account)" <svein-listmail@stillbilde.net> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HAL must die! Message-ID: <4D75BE6F.3000100@stillbilde.net> In-Reply-To: <AANLkTim_%2BZJ__dHF1i7NbAvbN65b8RNPo%2Bik=O5A9cot@mail.gmail.com> References: <alpine.BSF.2.00.1103061251530.95312@abbf.6qbyyneqvnyhc.pbz> <il2qar$ka1$1@dough.gmane.org> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1103071048200.903@abbf.onfvpvfc.arg> <AANLkTim_%2BZJ__dHF1i7NbAvbN65b8RNPo%2Bik=O5A9cot@mail.gmail.com>
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On 08.03.2011 04:36, Ivan Voras wrote:
> On 7 March 2011 19:44, Lars Eighner <luvbeastie@larseighner.com> wrote:=
>> On Mon, 7 Mar 2011, Ivan Voras wrote:
>>
>>> On 06/03/2011 19:56, Lars Eighner wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Using the -C switch with portupgrade, I am managing to turn WITH_HAL=
off
>>>> in
>>>> ports that I install or upgrade. Is there a way to make this a globa=
l
>>>> default?
>>>>
>>>> Is there a (convenient) way to list ports that might pull in HAL wit=
hout
>>>> having a configuration switch?
>>>
>>> Um, why exactly are so many people against HAL?
>>
>> It breaks my mouse and keyboard. I assume it would break other stuff =
if I
>> had esoteric devices.
>=20
>> with HAL =3D nothing works
>> without HAL =3D everything works
>=20
> Interesting, I had 0 problems with HAL ever since it was made.
But he does raise a valid problem (if more than zero users, etc). "We"
(I include fellow FreeBSD users, but also OSX and Linux users) do lack a
decent cross-platform device manager stack, with uniform device name
enumeration. DevFS (and its peers in Linux) does give us a start, but
not enough to build a system on. However, I suspect that getting this to
be truly cross-platform would take "a known name" in BSD-land,
OpenIndiana/Illumos and Cupertino agreeing with RMS that "making this
worth would be a nice summer-of-code project". Perhaps "AutoDevFS"
mounted on /autodev (names being picked from empty air with only
coffee-fumes). Such a framework would allow "drivers" to attach using
pipes, and thus allow (for instance) usb-upses to have python (or lua,
or <insert-name-of-interpreted-language-here) drivers, etc. "our world"
(unix-like world) hasn't had a truly common such stack since Bell Labs...=
>>> It's the only cross-platform thing available for non-Linux systems wh=
ich
>>> handles device enumeration, hotplugs, etc.
>>>
>>
>> I'm not running a cross-platform. I'm running FreeBSD. There were na=
tive
>> FreeBSD solutions to hotplugging the devices I use before HAL.
>=20
> Good luck with running your FreeBSD with FreeBSD-only applications :)
I'm less of an OS cleric. I run windows, freebsd, openindiana, irix (my
old indy still works), and <insertdeity>knowswhat. Not because I like
being confused, but because I chose tools for the task at hand, not
tasks from what my (least) favourite os can('t) do. I still want
something that works, and if it brings a decent standard into the loop,
it will make me sleep a little better. Getting something to REPLACE HAL
with, something that actually works, would provide me with more rest.
//Svein
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