From owner-freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Thu Dec 7 01:55:42 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09730E961FE for ; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 01:55:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (mailman.ysv.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::50:5]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE38D6F0BF for ; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 01:55:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) id DD864E961FD; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 01:55:41 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: arch@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD2F7E961FC for ; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 01:55:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from smtp-out-no.shaw.ca (smtp-out-no.shaw.ca [64.59.134.9]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9B1476F0BE; Thu, 7 Dec 2017 01:55:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@komquats.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([96.50.22.10]) by shaw.ca with SMTP id MlPWeQPzYp2osMlPXezs4x; Wed, 06 Dec 2017 18:55:40 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.2 cv=KLEqNBNo c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:117 a=jvE2nwUzI0ECrNeyr98KWA==:17 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=ocR9PWop10UA:10 a=mi56gJdQAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=EQgySroFtVL6OilYZpcA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=m6W23KLcDyq3lIHOBnQi:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [10.1.1.91]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 61AD1AB4; Wed, 6 Dec 2017 17:55:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id vB71tbJI006233; Wed, 6 Dec 2017 17:55:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id vB71tbRZ006229; Wed, 6 Dec 2017 17:55:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201712070155.vB71tbRZ006229@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Baptiste Daroussin cc: arch@FreeBSD.org, gshapiro@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: RFC: Sendmail deprecation ? In-Reply-To: Message from Baptiste Daroussin of "Wed, 06 Dec 2017 23:33:41 +0100." <20171206223341.iz3vj4zz2igqczy7@ivaldir.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2017 17:55:37 -0800 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfMyIKdtrFyqrfm14EX8ECxvEou4oAIczbhPFVSm60ojwANwLHoc/q1YxKHkiqX7FLVqP6iE4GQVXjCxjM5QFI9wlHC3qyGndJg/V49dx07T47VnbtAHV rQGhzldrUeOJzSenA+oJv7K4EGCpv9jMV2q9UJnrSQ2bv+mhtCnAQDvVGERXfV5hPKLGSEWAT4MAwxW+jh0iHVb0JGzPMchHhcRqhH1+j8w5G4Onb9s2fHzZ X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.25 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2017 01:55:42 -0000 In message <20171206223341.iz3vj4zz2igqczy7@ivaldir.net>, Baptiste Daroussin wr ites: > > --huu3o22uzx2iwrhs > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-Disposition: inline > > Hi all, > > I would like to propose the deprecation then removal of sendmail in base. > > Deprecation will happen in the form of FreeBSD 12.0 being built WITHOUT_SENDM > AIL > by default > > removal would happen in FreeBSD 13.0 > > sendmail in base it not really usable as a full featured mta due to the fact > it > does not support anything an entreprised grade mta setup would require: ldap > support for example, check the number of options available in the sendmail po > rt. > > Users for that use case would be better served by the port version of sendmai > l. > > The other kind of users are the one using the default setup of sendmail: > relaying emails externally and deliver locally. > > We have dma(8) which is way smaller than sendmail(8) have a configuration fil > e > understandable by most users (yet that is subjecttive) and have the setuid > binary capsicumized. > > dma(8) has been modified to fix issues reported by clusteradm preventing its > usage in real life situations: > https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=208263 > > I think only providing dma(8) by default and let users choose a full featured > mta via packages is a good solution and better for both sendmail users and no > n > sendmail users. Deprecate sendmail but no dma please. If anything, a small shell script to invoke dialog to allow the user to select their MTA package of choice. This could run at first boot -- which covers bsdinstall users and users who install from source. Please no dma. -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few.