From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Aug 26 16:24:11 2009 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF46E106568C for ; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:24:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from alex-goncharov@comcast.net) Received: from QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.64]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B25D8FC27 for ; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:24:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from OMTA19.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.98]) by QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id Yyr91c00227AodY574QBVG; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:24:11 +0000 Received: from daland.home ([24.34.211.11]) by OMTA19.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id Z4Tp1c0030FJTGg3f4U0l8; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:28:00 +0000 Received: from algo by daland.home with local (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1MgLHz-0001CG-Go; Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:23:59 -0400 From: Alex Goncharov To: Dag-Erling Smørgrav In-reply-to: <86hbvu64hg.fsf@ds4.des.no> (message from Dag-Erling Smørgrav on Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:20:59 +0200) References: <20090825034054.2d57e733@dev.lan.Awfulhak.org> <20090825134447.GM2829@hoeg.nl> <200908251609.09302.j.mckeown@ru.ac.za> <4A9407D3.60006@freebsd.org> <86hbvu64hg.fsf@ds4.des.no> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: Sender: Alex Goncharov Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2009 12:23:59 -0400 Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, kientzle@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Deprecating ps(1)s -w switch X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Alex Goncharov List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:24:12 -0000 ,--- You/Dag-Erling (Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:20:59 +0200) ----* | Tim Kientzle writes: | > The difference between "ps", "ps -w", and "ps -ww" is pretty | > significant for Java, in particular. Java command lines | > are typically enormous (thank you, CLASSPATH) which makes | > "ps -ww" often more annoying than it's worth. | | Java command lines aren't necessarily enormous. If they are, it is | because whoever invoked Java didn't know that it respects the CLASSPATH | environment variable, and that setting -classpath on the command line | f*s up the user's preferences (e.g. the user may want to replace a | particular set of classes with an alternative implementation). Using either the `-classpath' option to `java' or `CLASSPATH' environment variable is a pretty obsolete practice (whoever does either these days, should stop and re-think, IMHO.) The deficiency of the above, in either variation, is the need to list every `jar' file used, which gets ugly with more than a few files. A persons who keeps up with modern Java will call it with one or several of the options: -Djava.ext.dirs -Djava.library.path -Djava.endorsed.dirs Java Virtual Machine will internally list the files in each of the directories (specified on the command line or default ones), saving a user the effort to mention them explicitly in `CLASSPATH'. This cuts on the length of the command line dramatically, but still `java' processes' command lines are typically enormously long: even the lists of the directories, with their absolute paths are significant; on top of it, `java' is usually invoked with a gazillion of options modifying JVM's runtime behaviour. It's a fact of life that for real-life applications, `java' command lines are *long* -- you can't change that by moving from `-classpath' to `CLASSPATH'. (This said, I am not in favor of modifying `ps' in the manner proposed, as my previous message indicated.) -- Alex -- alex-goncharov@comcast.net --