Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 22:20:41 -0600 From: Nate Williams <nate@mt.sri.com> To: J_Shevland@TurnAround.com.au Cc: Chuck Robey <chuckr@picnic.mat.net>, Richard Levenberg <richard_levenberg@securecomputing.com>, java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Can I help with the JDK2 port? Message-ID: <199904300420.WAA17904@mt.sri.com> In-Reply-To: <372912BC.EE1A879B@TurnAround.com.au> References: <Pine.BSF.4.10.9904292142510.378-100000@picnic.mat.net> <372912BC.EE1A879B@TurnAround.com.au>
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> I've downloaded the sources and had a look at them; having > said that I'm willing to swallow my pride and say that it looks way too > intense for me and my knowledge of the FBSD compiling, linking, whatever > else is involved. No offense to anyone, but this is the comment I often hear. > I think there's a lot of people out there that want to help; that much > is clear. What I believe is needed is the management of this process and > will justify that by saying 'many hands make light work'. And this is the other comment I often here. If you aren't willing to do work because it's too difficult, then there's nothing for you to do. > > Good intentions are not good deeds. > > But can become them by someone taking responsibility for organisation > of tasks etc. You've said above 'God knows there's enough things to > do'. There are. Porting the code involves lots of things. But all of those things require a certain 'commitment' to understand the system as a whole. If you don't understand how the JDK works, then there is very little that a person can offer. If you can't work on the JDK porting effort to actually 'port' it, then I'm really confused as to how I'm supposed to find work for you, or anyone else that is unwilling/incapable of actually doing the port. This isn't something like building a house where I can hand you a hammer and say 'pound some nails into a piece of wood', since the 'house' has been completely built, but the foundation has to be replaced. > I think as a conclusion, the people that offer to help with the work, > want to know what these 'things' are. Once you've got a really good > understanding of the issues surrounding this, you can go off and do > your own thing and come out with offerings of 'real work'. Start porting and you will begin to understand what the issues are. They have been posted to the list a number of times. If you don't feel comfortable with doing that, I'm totally OK with that. But don't get mad or feel put off when someone says "if you aren't capable of diving in w/out any supervision or help, then there's nothing you can do." In this case, there is *NOTHING* you can do at this time, because it takes someone willing and capable of doing it all. At some point, it will be beneficial for people to test the JDK, but that time is not now. When that time happens, I (or someone else) will post a pointer to the code that can be tested, which *IS* something that anyone familiar with Java programming can do. > collaboration and information dissemination is what is needed, not an > argument. I think you have a mistaken impression that somehow 'porting' the JDK can be broken down into 'n' completely independant separate tasks. Unfortunately, it can't be. All of the 'indepedant' stuff is done for us by Sun. The hard part is making the 'dependant' stuff all work, and by definition it's totally dependant upon the OS and requires someone who knows alot about the OS or is willing to learn. Heck, I don't know nearly as much as a number of the people involved (Keith White is amazing), but I got involved anyway. With *ALL* free software projects (and it helps in most paid jobs), you must be self-motivated to get going, and self-motivation more than anything else means jumping in and doing *something*. If that task overlaps with a task someone else is doing it may be wasted time (but then again it may not because you have a better solution), but you'll learn something in the process. We need people willing to jump in and get their hands dirty, and not wait for someone to point the way. You aren't going to find Moses leading you to the promised land, and if you treat someone like Moses you may end up wandering around in the wilderness for a few years. :) Bottom line is 'just do it'. If you have something to show that's better than what we have (it wouldn't take a whole lot, trust me), we'll use your stuff. Then, you can be the leader and we can follow you around the desert for awhile. :) :) :) Nate ps. If my email appears to be short, I apologize. It is not my intent to appear short, but its frustrating to me to have people get angry about not seeing lists of simple tasks for them to do. There are no simple tasks that can be done, and stating that publically makes me into a bad guy, and I *hate* being the bad-guy. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message
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