From owner-freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 18 06:22:59 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0648106566C; Wed, 18 Jul 2012 06:22:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from utisoft@gmail.com) Received: from mail-bk0-f54.google.com (mail-bk0-f54.google.com [209.85.214.54]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E81658FC15; Wed, 18 Jul 2012 06:22:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: by bkcje9 with SMTP id je9so1124964bkc.13 for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2012 23:22:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=eR/QIZycxpoE2folfWS962mdbB3M8yh6EU6lqRTdiEo=; b=JxkzLc1Q39Xrg3yBsZuilUccSVaRk1FsQhIJ9+hwjm2hP3m5tWmNcu3mb+onWfLfkT PAjGCh0ItDMLL8rWJ/lxmfvBB/bg6weLSESOw9tcUSKyFqTP3xrUuJDQdAEWD5w1aMU4 vY497uA0QfqMPJ3NxYHNUOIi/W2pbJnnS5JTiOYaf1ivwnZBuRedU/cXGjnMi7iXuETp FDzKBiPYAde283tATT35YlFq8uu6nndd+tBY81YrxLCRXwngbA+tCTa+H6IQKbqrpfdm xlYODRjh9d87JlC8EvKYD9hcTBlI5kF6c92GU0NYcgIIdmgkrKDtouuV6DKBKlVoysQv CHgQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.205.133.11 with SMTP id hw11mr762205bkc.46.1342592577669; Tue, 17 Jul 2012 23:22:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.49.87 with HTTP; Tue, 17 Jul 2012 23:22:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.49.87 with HTTP; Tue, 17 Jul 2012 23:22:57 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <5005E2AE.3040806@marino.st> References: <50017C97.3050200@filez.com> <20120714192119.GA61563@vniz.net> <5001CB97.6070205@filez.com> <50054F6E.9040002@filez.com> <50055293.3010002@FreeBSD.org> <20120717213902.GB21825@lonesome.com> <5005E2AE.3040806@marino.st> Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 07:22:57 +0100 Message-ID: From: Chris Rees To: John Marino Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Mark Linimon , FreeBSD Mailing List , Michael Scheidell Subject: Re: maintainer timeout for FreeBSD commiters X-BeenThere: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting software to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2012 06:22:59 -0000 On 17 Jul 2012 23:17, "John Marino" wrote: > > On 7/17/2012 23:39, Mark Linimon wrote: >> >> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 07:54:59AM -0400, Michael Scheidell wrote: >>>>> >>>>> We *are* making progress in cutting through the backlog though. >>>> >>>> ports have about 900 open PR. Why it does not have more port >>>> commiters? Its difficult to recruit new person? >>> >>> The answer to that is very complex. >>> And, for each PR, maybe a different answer. >> >> >> This is true, but to address the previous question ... >> >> It is somewhat difficult to recruit new people who are willing to work >> within guidelines (both technical and social) and who seem to want to >> stay for the long-term. portmgr does screen candidates to try to make >> sure that the quality of the Ports Collection doesn't decline. Each >> vote is a judgement call. >> >> Having said that, we add new committers all the time. OTOH we add new >> ports all the time, and due to this the backlog seems to remain constant. >> >> And again, as scheidell notes, some PRs are more equal than others. >> >> mcl > > > Hi Mark, > I think that's a reasonable assessment about how the backlog seems about the same and how processes just naturally work. But I think it could work better. > > Let's take my case. > I'm a maintainer of several Ada ports and compilers. I'm also a pkgsrc committer, but not a FreeBSD ports committer. I have the same packages in both trees, but the pkgsrc packages (ports) are more current. That's obviously because I can commit to one tree at will but I have to submit PR and get in line for each update at FreeBSD (A quick shout out of appreciation to Frederic who has been tremendously gracious to me over these months). > > I was thinking about this - I really like how FreeBSD ports enforces to the best of its ability that every port have a maintainer. My name is on several ports and I have pride in my work. Would it be so bad if all my submitted patches (as a recognized quality contributor with history) just got committed as a passthrough? Obviously you might be reluctant to do this on ports that 200 packages depend on, but if you created a tier of contributors below committer but above PR submitter, I think a lot of ports would be maintained more often and there wouldn't be so much of a backlog. > > The worst case scenario is a contributor turns out to be a little sloppy, doesn't bother to use Tinderbox, etc, and after a couple of incidents you pull his privileges. The benefit you gain from the others would outweigh the incidents. > > I've seen the response that the committer is responsible for everything he or she commits, but if the community gave them immunity from consequences of maintainer patches, it shouldn't be a problem. > > I don't expect anything to come of this suggestion, but I've always wondered why more responsibility wasn't given to port maintainers who don't have commit privileges. I got around this by linking in my PRs a Tinderbox log showing a successful build. For some developers, this was enough to just commit. Not sure if I would feel the same way nowadays though ;) Of course there are names we recognise, and these people usually end up with a commit bit eventually anyway. Chris