From owner-freebsd-current Sun Dec 10 19:39:57 2000 From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 10 19:39:54 2000 Return-Path: <owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG> Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from ns.yogotech.com (ns.yogotech.com [206.127.123.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC24637B400 for <current@FreeBSD.ORG>; Sun, 10 Dec 2000 19:39:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from nomad.yogotech.com (nomad.yogotech.com [206.127.123.131]) by ns.yogotech.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA09428; Sun, 10 Dec 2000 20:39:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@nomad.yogotech.com) Received: (from nate@localhost) by nomad.yogotech.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA06326; Sun, 10 Dec 2000 20:39:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate) From: Nate Williams <nate@yogotech.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <14900.19591.200496.869754@nomad.yogotech.com> Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 20:39:51 -0700 (MST) To: Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org> Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Confusing error messages from shell image activation In-Reply-To: <14900.2598.958785.326648@guru.mired.org> References: <14898.33404.356173.963351@guru.mired.org> <14898.31393.228926.763711@guru.mired.org> <Pine.BSF.4.21.0012091347030.88984-100000@turtle.looksharp.net> <200012100904.CAA27546@harmony.village.org> <3A336781.94E1646@newsguy.com> <14899.41809.754369.259894@guru.mired.org> <200012101557.KAA29588@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> <14899.43958.622675.847234@guru.mired.org> <20001210120840.C38697@vger.bsdhome.com> <14899.47196.795281.662619@zircon.seattle.wa.us> <14899.49294.958909.82912@guru.mired.org> <14899.62738.768609.598990@nomad.yogotech.com> <14899.62189.243395.903919@nomad.yogotech.com> <14900.2598.958785.326648@guru.mired.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.75 under 21.1 (patch 12) "Channel Islands" XEmacs Lucid Reply-To: nate@yogotech.com (Nate Williams) Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > I'm aware that software was installing itself in /usr/local years > > > before it was installing in /opt. On the other hand, vendor software > > > was installing in /opt years before I ever saw it install in > > > /usr/local. > > Most vendor software I know pre-dates /opt, and installed itself in > > /usr/local. I'm with Warner on this one, installing in /usr/local > > predates /opt by many years. Before /opt, vendors always used > > /usr/local, or worse they installed in /bin and /usr/bin. > > Oh, I agree that installing things in /usr/local predates /opt by > years. I'm curious as to what vendor provided software installed > itself in /usr/local, though, as I've never seen any. I know that as recent as 3=4 years ago, Purify installed itself by default in /usr/local, on SunOS and Solaris. Lucid did this as well, although things start getting pretty fuzzy going back that far. :) > > > Then again, your quoting of "packages" points up something else - I > > > never saw prepackaged binaries for v6 or v7. > > I did on SysIII. As a matter of fact, the entire distribution was > > bundled into separate packets (all of them installed in /usr). :( > > SysIII was not something I ever worked with. I went from v7 to BSD > until, and stayed pretty much BSD until I started working with Solaris > in the early/mid 90s. I ran mostly DEC boxes until the early 90s, which had all software installed in /usr/bin or /usr/local/bin. > > In any case, I think you're wasting your time trying to convince folks > > here. It appears to me that this is an argument going nowhere, and the > > claims you're making of history and tradition are way off the mark, thus > > making the arguments have much less weight. > > I few this as consciousness-raising. That's an ongoing process. > > My claims about "history" and "tradition" are attempts to refute > Brandon's assertion that packages going into /usr/local has "years of > tradition behind it." Mostly, it's about what *packages* are, not what > /usr/local was used for. I disagree. > By your own admission, /usr/local wasn't used on v7. So the discussion > should turn to when BSD started seeing prebuilt vendor packages to > install in /usr/local. Late '80s on DEC boxes running Ultrix (which one could argue is one of the earliest commercial 'vendor' BSD unices). I don't consider Solaris a BSD unix, so it using /opt isn't a valid point, which makes the whole concept of '/opt' for BSD packages a moot point. :) Probably the same time-frame for SunOS, although I didn't have experience with it until the early 90's. However, if necessary, I can try and dig out installation docs for some software which ask to have the stuff unpacked in /usr/local. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message