From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jun 27 09:56:40 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0452037B401 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 09:56:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sccrmhc13.attbi.com (sccrmhc13.attbi.com [204.127.202.64]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F030043F75 for ; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 09:56:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from swear@attbi.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (12-230-74-101.client.attbi.com[12.230.74.101](untrusted sender)) by attbi.com (sccrmhc13) with ESMTP id <2003062716563701600plhroe>; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 16:56:38 +0000 Received: from localhost.localdomain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.9/8.12.5) with ESMTP id h5RGse9I081181; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 09:54:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from swear@attbi.com) Received: (from jojo@localhost) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.9/8.12.5/Submit) id h5RGsS5w081178; Fri, 27 Jun 2003 09:54:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from swear@attbi.com) X-Authentication-Warning: localhost.localdomain: jojo set sender to swear@attbi.com using -f To: FreeBSD Chat References: <4.3.2.7.2.20030625214311.00e5e240@localhost> <20030626110336.GW34365@iconoplex.co.uk> <20030626113553.GA53078@packet.org.uk> <20030626122023.GB763@nitro.dk> <20030626124601.GB57378@iconoplex.co.uk> <3EFBFEBD.B8772772@mindspring.com> From: swear@attbi.com (Gary W. Swearingen) Date: 27 Jun 2003 09:54:28 -0700 In-Reply-To: <3EFBFEBD.B8772772@mindspring.com> Message-ID: Lines: 27 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: RMS says: "Use BSD, for goodness sake!" X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Jun 2003 16:56:40 -0000 Terry Lambert writes: > For most of the things you mention, they are included in > "The Programmer's Workbench" from Bell Labs, which is now > available for free download, including ksh93, awk, troff, > etc.. > > Why not use the real things, if you are going to replace the > GNU replacements? Maybe because AT&T's licenses are over the "onerous" threshold too. Eg, ksh93's at http://www.research.att.com/sw/license/ast-open.html It impresses me as the most well-written license I've seen, and it pleases me by it's acknowledgment that the software is "proprietary" (which is contrary to the wide misuse of the term in the open-source world, while strictly accurate in the GNU-speak meaning of "not GPL-compatible"), BUT it is the most protective of an open source licensor's rights of any license I can remember and it has MANY onerous terms which I doubt that few derivers would be willing to work under. I'm not sure it's even worth the risks to use their software as-is, given terms such as found in the indemnification section. This term from the first section helps set the tone of the thing: You will regularly monitor the [AT&T] Website for any notices.