From nobody Wed Jul 30 02:18:40 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4bsG9P3CbWz62xqF for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2025 02:18:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from shawn.webb@hardenedbsd.org) Received: from mail-io1-xd2e.google.com (mail-io1-xd2e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4bsG9P0ztZz3V07 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2025 02:18:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from shawn.webb@hardenedbsd.org) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: by mail-io1-xd2e.google.com with SMTP id ca18e2360f4ac-87c11fd5364so232313439f.1 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2025 19:18:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=hardenedbsd.org; s=google; t=1753841923; x=1754446723; darn=freebsd.org; h=in-reply-to:content-disposition:mime-version:references:message-id :subject:cc:to:from:date:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=FWyKtvViwAipW1o2CtrZRsm/eREDJagaPbgzxTkraDY=; b=Rb3vl+h83sjsaFa1hgXW/VzleDpf93iwO/79IGvo0kOElEX1VyYVPb+uB6RiyJSJ6V PLzkn+tUnU+PcTE11lRHks9Q51sfptNcSODAbCrBcpFlrkMLU6hhyirqYIjnjFw403/E bV5N8clwtBhk2fGslYp4gP4RERbklzfugiXE7YigKdLizIYYzN7b/RIm8z0g7o1YPU9i 65c1/+3rVDjplodCwp8bmuE9TMJvQMPWOsqT8I4NEGXv7evLh6XgyJ+0U1t3U1ElvSnN wNwbBDW3bEzHAYoR8iMunB7XzuadYVNS7ajH0NYULbs0v3kg3+H8Ybd0JSfCSFkTILxC wpYQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1753841923; x=1754446723; h=in-reply-to:content-disposition:mime-version:references:message-id :subject:cc:to:from:date:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=FWyKtvViwAipW1o2CtrZRsm/eREDJagaPbgzxTkraDY=; b=FXNXoio8sFQwcIbMCvUFRKegWuFKtEtoOY/19Kk5n8l5yPb+JAQppwB3Qgg7Tr1PdZ mk0Qu3h/LyHTEcLOmZHDWCO9XpXCRNPd+Sya8veiGRZPCkO1aHemPoYzPqb3bPlB73YC /7VGb9EOzztyQMNkqahR/8DuYBdfNR9IExv2+o+I1MmaSdqnS1kbV1uK+W22Y+VnugOO iXWVSvhsaBXHDrpSLndIMSIFTHQ3lb9LlTkKvrPwOS9zr6e8hUWWlJHU3DfcTSEXYSHy wJn/mdXoWl739NHrLHZFp7vB5vMCp2ztPOKYTsq1kxLeuhjhG1c6o+O85mfZYHsLbg5v rHVw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzPyPkNVu9gYEKnd5/m8KaUeaC6JwJ1Bqwr9oV15loOh28PZCEp vGalTsuj7N4X4M5uDQZTIYISWN7iLVBZp/0qwUNYqLZqXl7GZfqWucwxH8gFdltF++I= X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncuNUEkJSMeJGSH1YXSylDLrUIvEytgD9+asFrA69KMYNqpvStLnL4lW/i2+4Ps Lzi3zQ3hzDSjhqPy77oqJf/2vDZEOySdgzR368KUoxJNRcZAqNtKoKmjSmr4VwzP34ogGQnUOQg ocbVWcAqY8/AW6g0pO2xEctwMx/mGu0WhBcalsi6uauPC0YZCAOTSwfMqFsM6Narfom6+KCrcwb 0cmV/QYEhsLsNuLr6xZPaXHoi4xOSQ8izPGW6ZhMQIBHgrMOx6bhrlaZ6nCGmZIyoHgNHECX6SK DO5ZgyxQ9KQFhk1iyLdT77p5vgP47y9BqUupEWxAEh7stMaQBVb6SxFTzT7rV1CX5yw/k/36uoS FY1G8 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEzBfOD66Qlv0na0anm5FSqJP2wHRJRzCEGvy2KFUR7UTeNm8X52UOxSXYaMxYhz62wPJilTQ== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6e02:1906:b0:3e3:d252:c0b5 with SMTP id e9e14a558f8ab-3e3f60d1cbdmr29535425ab.1.1753841922984; Tue, 29 Jul 2025 19:18:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mutt-hbsd ([2001:470:4001:1::95]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 8926c6da1cb9f-508c91edeb1sm3027875173.35.2025.07.29.19.18.40 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 29 Jul 2025 19:18:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2025 02:18:40 +0000 From: Shawn Webb To: vermaden Cc: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature Message-ID: X-Operating-System: FreeBSD mutt-hbsd 14.3-STABLE-HBSD FreeBSD 14.3-STABLE-HBSD HARDENEDBSD-14-STABLE amd64 X-PGP-Key: https://git.hardenedbsd.org/hardenedbsd/pubkeys/-/blob/master/Shawn_Webb/03A4CBEBB82EA5A67D9F3853FF2E67A277F8E1FA.pub.asc References: List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="z6ngwkyglkjghwbx" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4bsG9P0ztZz3V07 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US] --z6ngwkyglkjghwbx Content-Type: text/plain; protected-headers=v1; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature MIME-Version: 1.0 On Wed, Jul 30, 2025 at 02:28:35AM +0200, vermaden wrote: > Hi, >=20 > after short discussion here: > - https://github.com/freebsd/pkg/issues/2485 >=20 > I got REALLY concerned. >=20 > One of THE features and selling points of a FreeBSD UNIX system is the 'u= ntouchable' Base System. >=20 > Without PKGBASE all the features are preserved. >=20 > But when You convert to PKGBASE its ... GONE! >=20 > Consider this command: >=20 > # pkg delete -af >=20 > What it does? >=20 > It removes all third party packages on 'classic' FreeBSD system without t= ouching the FreeBSD Base System. >=20 > What the same "pkg delete -af" command does on a PKGBASE FreeBSD system? >=20 > It kills/destroys almost all of the FreeBSD Base System and leaves only t= wo PKGBASE packages called: >=20 > - FreeBSD-clibs > - FreeBSD-runtime >=20 > All the rest of Base System is GONE. Destroyed. Hey vermaden, As mentioned in the GitHub ticket, it appears there might be some room for discussion on which base packages ought to be marked vital and if the current list (of two) should be expanded. I suspect there could also be room for discussion on technical measures pkg could adopt to help mitigate issues like this. I myself don't have much in the way of suggestions on either topic of discussion. I'm simply hoping this email moves the needle forward in a positive direction. Thanks, --=20 Shawn Webb Cofounder / Security Engineer HardenedBSD Signal Username: shawn_webb.74 Tor-ified Signal: +1 303-901-1600 / shawn_webb_opsec.50 https://git.hardenedbsd.org/hardenedbsd/pubkeys/-/raw/master/Shawn_Webb/03A= 4CBEBB82EA5A67D9F3853FF2E67A277F8E1FA.pub.asc --z6ngwkyglkjghwbx Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEEA6TL67gupaZ9nzhT/y5nonf44foFAmiJgPgACgkQ/y5nonf4 4fraZhAApJo0TCgSjFHuLLDOsTetAdFO45PwxZuwQKo9Q490cI3o8cJdOjjb0S8Z 9vouPbkv1ffTN0dTqnUhJajcpRgXKXyvxA83F7qJDin+p87rZcBpKlnTbeQrm2Rt 0J3EcsaAsCIlwgeLtpdcvYBEWlC5i4ffw62sQN8R+ip1A1p6cNEmIzonq+PZrZF3 lZXgEGd9ubOwjOwKq7ZEduZJoCn1j5CXoNN/zYQQVNCTVDTEnRncEj8TUp/4qt5W f3W4MZZUqRD6Z7s66T4etYuju9gcDK/OhZ9oaA0/v7XmMhzTK15EegjjrW7epDZc hBCHd/yboD5Q1mj+Af9pz2ohC5pnU7iC9I2c+MvX2BNB2J+yRUQuHP9GXVIUOsb2 N1AtCRiaudzCV/66CW4tERIwwmZJ+61Tiy4JgHn07IIO8+/lRt4mALK28yYG+uGq OzQG1Q72z3S9JkyVokkA9L1WN+jplgdIfOsW72GlQqfjr6h7uHkiSUNKQ9wOOcpZ oq7lY7Fon1pQmolK8kVT4k28trgfIewtyDYU3vLflrVgD6M/+sFJ2vHIpLHkZevA nvw3tBWUjT3O0ZRNGtudLwsd5LnqSJ5D0mdeJwWXizDIjvCcVE0IHqVJpL3uZUPn iEmGMu7Ida7OzyLCHjsSu6IHvYiWIofxRbpLN0qEKI9/PKOLGaM= =ivPd -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --z6ngwkyglkjghwbx--