Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2018 12:54:28 -0700 From: Doug Hardie <bc979@lafn.org> To: Brooks Davis <brooks@freebsd.org> Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-net@freebsd.org, freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FCP-0101: Deprecating most 10/100 Ethernet drivers Message-ID: <15FCEA6B-C017-40C5-8193-8C7AA3F563CC@mail.sermon-archive.info> In-Reply-To: <20181003210516.GA71565@spindle.one-eyed-alien.net> References: <20181003210516.GA71565@spindle.one-eyed-alien.net>
next in thread | previous in thread | raw e-mail | index | archive | help
I have a number of production servers that only have bge and I don't see = that listed in either category. None of them are running FreeBSD 12 yet = as it has not been released. Also there are some with rl. Those are = add-on boards so they could be changed, but would require extensive = effort as the machines are about a 4 hour drive from here and would = require reconfiguration (an error prone process when you are tired). I also have two production machines with ue devices. There is no = provision for replacing them. They are running an early version of 12 = as 11 doesn't run on those machines. I don't see ue listed in either = category. -- Doug > On 3 October 2018, at 14:05, Brooks Davis <brooks@freebsd.org> wrote: >=20 >>>> Please direct replies to freebsd-arch <<< >=20 > FCP-01010 (https://github.com/freebsd/fcp/blob/master/fcp-0101.md) > outlines a plan to deprecate most 10/100 Ethernet drivers in FreeBSD = 12 > and remove them in FreeBSD 13 to reduce the burden of maintaining and > improving the network stack. We have discussed this within the > core team and intend to move forward as proposed. We are solictiting > feedback on the list of drivers to be excepted from removal. >=20 > The current list of drivers slated for REMOVAL is: >=20 > ae, bfe, bm, cs, dme, ed, ep, ex, fe, pcn, rl, sf, smc, sn, > ste, tl, tx, txp, vx, wb, xe >=20 > The current list of drivers that will STAY in the tree is: >=20 > dc, ffec, fxpl, hme, le, sis, vr, xl >=20 > The criteria for exception are: > - Popular in applications where it is likely to be deployed beyond the > support lifetime of FreeBSD 12 (late 2023). > - 5 reports of uses in the wild on machines running FreeBSD 12 will = be > deemed satisfy the "popular" > requirement. > - Required to make a well supported embedded or emulation platform = usable. > - Ported to use iflib (reducing future maintenance cost.) >=20 > Please reply to this message with nominations to the exception list. >=20 > The full FCP-0101 is included below. >=20 > -- Brooks >=20 > --- > authors: Brooks Davis <brooks@freebsd.org> > state: feedback > --- >=20 > # FCP 101: Deprecation and removal of 10/100 Ethernet drivers >=20 > Deprecate most 10 and 10/100Mbps Ethernet drivers and remove them = before > FreeBSD 13. >=20 > ## Problem Statement >=20 > Each network driver creates drag for the project as we attempt to > improve the network stack or provide new features such as expanded > 32-bit compatibility. For example, the author has edited every single > NIC driver more than once in the past year to update management = (`ioctl`) > interfaces. We could improve this situation by converting drivers to > iflib, but each additional driver takes work. >=20 > 10 and 100 megabit Ethernet drivers are largely irrelevant today > and we have a significant number of them in the tree. The ones that > are no longer used and/or are not known to be working need to be > removed due to the significant ongoing 'tax' on new development. >=20 > For at least a decade, most systems (including small embedded > systems) have shipped with gigabit Ethernet devices and virtual > machines commonly emulate popular gigabit devices. We wish to > retain support for popular physical and virtual devices while > removing support for uncommon ones. With a few exceptions these > drivers are unlikely to be used by our user base by the time FreeBSD > 12 is obsolete (approximately 2024). >=20 > ## Proposed Solution >=20 > We propose to deprecate devices which are not sufficiently popular. = This > will entail: > - (October 2018) Send this list to freebsd-net and freebsd-stable. > - (Before FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - October 2018) Update the manpages and > attach routines for each device to be removed and merge those = changes > to FreeBSD 12. > - (One month after FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - January 2018) Remind > freebsd-net and freebsd-stable users of pending deletion. > - (Two months after FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - February 2019) Delete = deprecated > devices. >=20 > Through out this process, solicit feedback on additions to the = exception > list and update this document as required. For a device to be placed = on > the exception list the device must meet one of the following criteria: > - Popular in applications where it is likely to be deployed beyond the > support lifetime of FreeBSD 12 (late 2023). > - 5 reports of uses in the wild on machines running FreeBSD 12 will = be > deemed satisfy the "popular" > requirement. > - Required to make a well supported embedded or emulation platform = usable. > - Ported to use iflib (reducing future maintenance cost.) >=20 > ### Exceptions to removal >=20 > Device | Reason > -------|------------------------------------------------- > ffec | Onboard Ethernet for Vybrid arm7 boards > fxp | Popular device long recommended by the project. > dc | Popular device for CardBus card. > hme | Built in interface on many supported sparc64 platforms. > le | Emulated by QEMU, alternatives don't yet work for mips64. > sis | Soekris Engineering net45xx, net48xx, lan1621, and lan1641. > vr | Soekris Engineering net5501, some Asus motherboards. > xl | Popular device for CardBus card. >=20 > Note: USB devices have been excluded from consideration in this round. >=20 > ### Device to be removed >=20 > ae, bfe, bm, cs, dme, ed, ep, ex, fe, pcn, rl, sf, smc, sn, > ste, tl, tx, txp, vx, wb, xe >=20 > ## Final Disposition >=20 > TBD
Want to link to this message? Use this URL: <https://mail-archive.FreeBSD.org/cgi/mid.cgi?15FCEA6B-C017-40C5-8193-8C7AA3F563CC>