From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Mar 24 15:23:34 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F71A16A4CE for ; Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:23:34 +0000 (GMT) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90BFB43D31 for ; Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:23:32 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from EM1897@aol.com) Received: from EM1897@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v37_r5.33.) id n.f.417f8705 (16099) for ; Thu, 24 Mar 2005 10:23:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mblk-d19 (mblk-d19.mblk.aol.com [205.188.212.203]) by air-id11.mx.aol.com (v104.18) with ESMTP id MAILINID113-3ee34242db6e233; Thu, 24 Mar 2005 10:23:26 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 10:23:26 -0500 Message-Id: <8C6FE9C8F1C50E9-B50-2E021@mblk-d19.sysops.aol.com> From: em1897@aol.com References: <20050323225053.7793.qmail@web90210.mail.scd.yahoo.com> <8C6FE1416E7B78A-B30-25840@mblk-r10.sysops.aol.com> <424256E6.5030301@ec.rr.com> Received: from 24.47.116.25 by mblk-d19.sysops.aol.com (205.188.212.203) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Thu, 24 Mar 2005 10:23:26 -0500 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User In-Reply-To: <424256E6.5030301@ec.rr.com> X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 1.0.0.11984 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-AOL-IP: 205.188.212.203 Subject: Re: AMD64 much slower than i386 on FreeBSD 5.4-pre X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:23:34 -0000 I think that warning people that the good name of "FreeBSD" is being tainted by the current band of clowns is very productive. Its more like a religion now; I've never seen so many people in total denial that their beliefs are completely wrong. A lot of people are wasting a lot of time because of this propaganda. The cluelessness in the performance list is a good indication. -----Original Message----- From: jason henson To: em1897@aol.com Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; hardcodeharry@yahoo.com Sent: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 00:57:58 -0500 Subject: Re: AMD64 much slower than i386 on FreeBSD 5.4-pre em1897@aol.com wrote:    > >  >> The answer, Boris, is that the "team" has no idea what >> they're doing. Check out some of the threads on >> performance testing. They tune little pieces here >> and there, and break 10 other things in the process. >> Matt Dillon "determined" that 10,000 ints/second >> was "optimal". Of course if you're passing 10Kpps >> that means you get an interrupt for every >> packet. >> >> They're playing pin the tail on the donkey. >> >  > You could understand what he was saying? I wanted to help but was > unsure of what he was asking. I also seem to remember that discussion > you are referring too. IIRC, 10,000hz for pooling was the setting they > ere talking about. But on it would very a little, and with the fxp > based card polling hurt a little because the card was already ding its > own thing in hardware. So that setting was redundant, it was best to > leave it alone. > He also seemed to say the network bandwidth was constant, and system > load rose with an 64bit system. This right? If he was using GENERIC on > a smp system he was only using 1 cpu with out a recompile. There is > just so much that could be wrong and he gives no information on his > system or settings. > Doess he have 2 amd64 pcs with 2 different installs of 5.3, or a > single machine that he ran both versions on? The router, is that a > third machine that was an amd64 system, or something else? He says > i386, but an up to date 5.3 world doesn't support 386 with out a work > around. The least commom setting is now 486, but a build for 686 would > be better. Did he tell you if he had polling on? > > So I guess it is a good thing you were able to help him, because I > couldn't. Not to mention the flame bait you through out, well, that > would be wrong. _______________________________________________ >  > --------- Previous Message  >  > No, thats not what I was talking about. They were tuning the MAX_INTS > parameter for the em  > driver, which can hold off interrupts to reduce system overhead. > Instead of minimizing the load,  > they were focused on squeezing a few extra bits out of iperf, which is > not how you tune  > performance. If you get 700Kb/s and have a 95% load and can get > 695Kb/s with 60% load,  > which is better? Plus they were testing with a regular PCI bus, so > they were hitting the  > wall on the bus throughput, which changes all the timings, so it was > just a stupid test in  > general.    I would say 60% load. Now I completely understand what you were saying.    >  > I'm not 100% sure of what he was saying, but I've seen the same thing. > I take an i386 disk  > and pop on an amd64 disk with the same settings, except for the 3 or 4 > required differences,  > and the i386 machine has WAY less network load. So maybe your > buildworld runs faster,  > but the whole interrupt/process switching mechanism runs like crap, so > you likely have a  > slower machine. I haven't seen any test that shows otherwise, just a > bunch of swell  > guys swearing that one thing is faster than another.  >  > I understand that you don't want to hear the truth, so flame away. But > its not going to make  > things any better.    Ahh! More flame bait! I just didn't like you platitudinal and unproductive message that I believe would just drive Boris onto linux and leave a possible open problem on FreeBSD for some one else to discover latter. It's not that I don't want to hear the truth, you were just not saying anything worth his time. But atleast now we can get some where to help him and the amd64 port. I also had the idea that Boris was just trolling because he has not responded, just said FreeBSD was bad and left us to duke it out.    > _______________________________________________  > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list  > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions  > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org"  >  So the whole interrupt/process switching mechanism runs like crap with the amd64 build? Since I don't have a amd64 system, and you might hav access to atleast 1, how about getting a little info on the irqs? Look at systat -vmstat or vmstat -i under load? aybe report it back? I wonder if the irq rates are changing, or irqs are taking longer to service. Either there is a problem. Ofcourse some hardware info would be nice, chipset and cpu? Maybe you script vmstat -i for a log, and use netperf too?   I like Nick's followup. I would guese Boris may have a problem with proper hardware support. I can't really said it is bad hardware if speeds are the same, just high load(right?). Maybe the driver he is using is not good for 64bit as it is for 32bit?    I think if Boris studies the thread I like to below he will be alright.   Check this out:  http://www.atm.tut.fi/list-archive/freebsd-stable/thrd66.html  http://docs.freebsd.org/cgi/mid.cgi?200502171636.10361.drice    Inparticular:  http://www.atm.tut.fi/list-archive/freebsd-stable/msg19651.html  http://www.atm.tut.fi/list-archive/freebsd-stable/msg19679.html