From owner-freebsd-stable Mon Jan 28 5:36:50 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: from veldy.net (veldy-host33.dsl.visi.com [209.98.200.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 200D537B404 for ; Mon, 28 Jan 2002 05:36:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from HP2500B (localhost.veldy.net [127.0.0.1]) by veldy.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 996661A191; Mon, 28 Jan 2002 07:36:43 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006b01c1a800$86ff28e0$3028680a@tgt.com> From: "Thomas T. Veldhouse" To: "Cliff Sarginson" , References: <20020127220923.B1494@shell.gsinet.sittig.org> <20020127134511.Q81780-100000@rockstar.stealthgeeks.net> <20020128064925.GA1180@raggedclown.net> Subject: Re: Firewall config non-intuitiveness Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2002 07:34:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG All right -- it is time ..... Hitler. Tom Veldhouse veldy@veldy.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cliff Sarginson" To: Sent: Monday, January 28, 2002 12:49 AM Subject: Re: Firewall config non-intuitiveness > On Sun, Jan 27, 2002 at 02:50:50PM -0800, Patrick Greenwell wrote: > > > > Really, I'm just arguing for doing something that makes sense, and the > > current behavior does not qualify, regardless of how long it's been > > understood to be broken that way. Even if this behavior were adequately > > documented, which it isn't, it's extremely user-unfriendly to have no mean > > yes. > > > > At this point I'm rather reticent to even bother submitting anything to > > the "security officer" role as Warner has indicated that he's part of that > > role and will speak out against it in the name of security. I'm not a > > member of the inner circle, just a long-time user who saw some confusing > > behavior and thought that there was an opportunity to fix it. > > > I think you were quite right to, and I think you are right. > But you are fighting the forces of reaction here, in my view. > This whole thread has been a very depressing reflection on the > inability of any of the people arguing against you to make > any coherent argument against changing something to make sense. > > This is just conservative status-quoism gone mad. > > You are not alone in finding the current wording and behaviour > of this feature inconsistent, and initially incoherent. > > Perhaps we are just too dumb. > > -- > Regards > Cliff > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-stable" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-stable" in the body of the message