From owner-freebsd-stable Tue Apr 23 12:20:10 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: from guru.mired.org (dsl-64-192-6-133.telocity.com [64.192.6.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E825137B41F for ; Tue, 23 Apr 2002 12:20:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mwm@localhost) by guru.mired.org (8.11.1/8.11.2) id g3NJK0m38311 for freebsd-stable@freebsd.org; Tue, 23 Apr 2002 14:20:00 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from mwm-dated-1020021600.7915bc@mired.org) X-Authentication-Warning: guru.mired.org: mwm set sender to mwm-dated-1020021600.7915bc@mired.org using -f MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15557.46037.660880.582373@guru.mired.org> Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 14:19:49 -0500 To: kudzu@tenebras.com Cc: Lucky Green , freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: /etc/defaults/rc.conf theory In-Reply-To: <3CC4E3D4.6010603@tenebras.com> References: <002d01c1ea7d$cf1cb060$c33a080a@LUCKYVAIO> <3CC4E3D4.6010603@tenebras.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.90 under 21.1 (patch 14) "Cuyahoga Valley" XEmacs Lucid X-face: "5Mnwy%?j>IIV\)A=):rjWL~NB2aH[}Yq8Z=u~vJ`"(,&SiLvbbz2W`;h9L,Yg`+vb1>RG% *h+%X^n0EZd>TM8_IB;a8F?(Fb"lw'IgCoyM.[Lg#r\ From: Mike Meyer X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.51 (Python 2.2 on FreeBSD/i386) Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In <3CC4E3D4.6010603@tenebras.com>, Michael Sierchio typed: > > Depends on the user. My rc.conf has perhaps 15 lines and some of those > > are simply there because the OpenSSH and bind ports in STABLE tend to > > lag quite a bit behind the release and the port versions are installed > > in different directories than the those that come with the default > > FreeBSD distribution. > Same here. And here. > But it is UTTERLY ABSURD that everything isn't installed as a package -- > even those components in the base system, so they can be removed and > replaced with, for example, the ports versions. True. If you want to contribute towards changing this, the libh project is looking for people. > I don't run BIND or Sendwhale^H^H^H^H^Hmail. I want the version of > OpenSSH in the ports. And why the heck is OpenSSL in the system? Because SSH is considered part of a complete system. > It's extremely difficult to track -STABLE or -SECURITY and maintain > a configuration used in a professional environment. I'm happy for > hobbyists to do as they please, but this is another barrier to > gaining acceptance for our favorite OS. I don't find it difficult at all. Then again, I make liberal use of the NO_* options in /etc/make.conf. I suggest you do the same. > The rationale for inclusion in the base system as opposed to ports > has usually been licensing issues. By some odd quirk, I've never heard any such rationale. > The trend toward including everything needs to STOP. We clearly aren't including "everything". There's lots of stuff that isn't included. In fact, the *only* two reasons I've ever run into for adding something to the base system was that 1) it's required to build part of the base system, or 2) it's become a critical component of a complete system. Some mailer and some ssh need to be part of the base system. If they aren't up to snuff for you and you aren't happy disabling things in the base system and installing ports, then you need to find someone to maintain a version you want as part of the base system, and then convince everyone else that this is better. Tracking OpenSSL/OpenSSH closer is probably an easy sell. The same is not true for sendmail. http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-stable" in the body of the message