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Date:      Sat, 13 Oct 2012 15:15:59 -0400
From:      George Neville-Neil <gnn@neville-neil.com>
To:        Marcel Moolenaar <marcel@xcllnt.net>
Cc:        Garrett Cooper <yanegomi@gmail.com>, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, "Simon J. Gerraty" <sjg@juniper.net>, freebsd-arch@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: [CFT/RFC]: refactor bsd.prog.mk to understand multiple programs instead of a singular program
Message-ID:  <1340AB5D-F824-4E7D-9D6C-F7E5489AE870@neville-neil.com>
In-Reply-To: <127FA63D-8EEE-4616-AE1E-C39469DDCC6A@xcllnt.net>
References:  <CAGH67wRkOmy7rWLkxXnT2155PuSQpwOMyu7dTAKeO1WW2dju7g@mail.gmail.com> <201210020750.23358.jhb@freebsd.org> <CAGH67wTM1VDrpu7rS=VE1G_kVEOHhS4-OCy5FX_6eDGmiNTA8A@mail.gmail.com> <201210021037.27762.jhb@freebsd.org> <CAGH67wQffjVHqFw_eN=mfeg-Ac2Z6XBT5Hv72ev0kjjx7YH7SA@mail.gmail.com> <127FA63D-8EEE-4616-AE1E-C39469DDCC6A@xcllnt.net>

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On Oct 8, 2012, at 12:11 , Marcel Moolenaar <marcel@xcllnt.net> wrote:

>=20
> On Oct 4, 2012, at 9:42 AM, Garrett Cooper <yanegomi@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Both parties (Isilon/Juniper) are converging on the ATF porting =
work
>>>> that Giorgos/myself have done after talking at the FreeBSD =
Foundation
>>>> meet-n-greet. I have contributed all of the patches that I have =
other
>>>> to marcel for feedback.
>>>=20
>>> This is very non-obvious to the public at large (e.g. there was no =
public
>>> response to one group's inquiry about the second ATF import for =
example).
>>> Also, given that you had no idea that sgf@ and obrien@ were working =
on
>>> importing NetBSD's bmake as a prerequisite for ATF, it seems that =
whatever
>>> discussions were held were not very detailed at best.  I think it =
would be
>>> good to have the various folks working on ATF to at least summarize =
the
>>> current state of things and sketch out some sort of plan or roadmap =
for future
>>> work in a public forum (such as atf@, though a summary mail would be =
quite
>>> appropriate for arch@).
>>=20
>> I'm in part to blame for this. There was some discussion -- but not =
at
>> length; unfortunately no one from Juniper was present at the meet and
>> greet; the information I got was second hand; I didn't follow up to
>> figure out the exact details / clarify what I had in mind with the
>> appropriate parties.
>=20
> Hang on. I want in on the blame part! :-)
>=20
> Seriously: no-one is really to blame as far as I can see. We just had
> two independent efforts (ATF & bmake) and there was no indication that
> one would be greatly benefitted from the other. At least not to the
> point of creating a dependency.
>=20
> I just committed the bmake bits. It not only adds bmake to the build,
> but also includes the changes necessary to use bmake.
>=20
> With that in place it's easier to decide whether we want the =
dependency
> or not.
>=20
> Before we can switch permanently to bmake, we need to do the following
> first:
> 1.  Request an EXP ports build with bmake as make(1). This should tell
>    us the "damage" of switching to bmake for ports.
> 2.  In parallel with 1: build www & docs with bmake and assess the
>    damage
> 3.  Fix all the damage
>=20
> Then:
>=20
> 4.  Switch.
>=20
> It could be a while (many weeks) before we get to 4, so the question
> really is whether the people working on ATF are willing and able to
> build and install FreeBSD using WITH_BMAKE?
>=20

I think that's a small price to pay for getting going with the ATF
stuff now rather than in 4 weeks.  What's the right way to do this
now with HEAD?

Best,
George





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