From owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Wed Feb 26 00:26:34 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CB04245C72 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2020 00:26:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mario.olofo@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qk1-x744.google.com (mail-qk1-x744.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::744]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48RxS8757Dz4Ypp for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2020 00:26:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mario.olofo@gmail.com) Received: by mail-qk1-x744.google.com with SMTP id b7so1029799qkl.7 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2020 16:26:32 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=3VyAT5UMINWLjp2T/mOeHtjAD9W/I2kYW0SpYa/kqsI=; b=eDTcGh51rPUWpW6s1I8Wr7vuuEnyDQmF8QNToDqDqOuhaXNTOEhKGCK7ZAcjEJ68ox 3kdVVWPK2Z/83eXM6O18CBQCSrtN1mtzLLnEJfoZ4kCHOUl2SuJRiMTsHCZgy380JUV1 dRIGkrkQI/Z9TrwzO8s3RULeHflK7yI7qCDIe8zveNZ5Cn3Usm5wvbR4+SIpJOiYlDCh msGuDYfFHxCeq/508bC4ddmbdl997F778HBFAiyk3sSZDiJZP4eaVB5OZI5EqSzaiweX K5MyFH7UXWJ6oE+zZRGTsem70xrhKjvldpZi112g4hI2pYBZ4B7Moe+/KWVEA+3TJ1am HuqQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=3VyAT5UMINWLjp2T/mOeHtjAD9W/I2kYW0SpYa/kqsI=; b=SgREhyhWsvxafU+lXQ6I2SQhI6k/NMYH0Sm2so5Y882ykwP8GZ4UzIA0RCdTt84tkt i0IG6ODoCYo9BwwckyEPS92kqRSagFhmtU/ECUe1+sgB02fDntoMbVlaRXO9aCeDWvSr X7JkHxdepONCZ8Dr8zKjP18dIFMAQNysrak37MGvdcE4dAqYuDlXW2oe4FoGBm6PxmVA f6BYRVKSlE9FM/40Wx7luXa9fKKIBkTuySrTpPEy4Fbr0NGXpjU9t/GPPHVW1q+RHQPD ooPhOaX569WWHGzBoHHpNHCgx40WL4zzWw1j74C3+Pq63l+91XoBiwcvhU9b/orL6tfw u92Q== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUgWm+CXxN/aEFaIJ4cOpSChMDiHQizoBDTuPJa12e+7RIum2q9 xXb1cu8Jen1SwVNryt2SORzH0QSpNlzywQoFhyWiA3Vc0no= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqziNUExm1cE+PGCtqiZQEPPJK59aEeuaRdkl64YN29DNAq/SVUY6WA6WlLGP4gSkqE9ijm5MwM/KDDaxUiuePw= X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:522:: with SMTP id h2mr1936484qkh.260.1582676791721; Tue, 25 Feb 2020 16:26:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <202002250115.01P1F9KX090465@mail.karels.net> <188F34DA-192C-4D44-96B5-18A7DAE8EC67@digsys.bg> <6028c786-8610-01d9-818e-6f69a2fe9645@ingresso.co.uk> <20200225145346.GA42880@phouka1.phouka.net> <6e329bb8-b96e-fa16-cc73-426685593943@denninger.net> In-Reply-To: From: Mario Olofo Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2020 21:26:20 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Running FreeBSD on M.2 SSD To: George Michaelson Cc: FreeBSD Stable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48RxS8757Dz4Ypp X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=eDTcGh51; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of marioolofo@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::744 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=marioolofo@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-stable@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.4.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (1.64), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.88), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2020 00:26:34 -0000 Hybrid HDD are the norm for notebooks, that is, 1TB hard drive with 16GB of SSD internal memory for fast writes and hot data (most used pages). In my case, the notebook came with a ST1000LX015, but the problem happened on the SSD, not on this HDD. The SSD is a WD Green m.2, Rebecca already posted a link to the model: https://shop.westerndigital.com/products/internal-drives/wd-green-sata-ssd#= WDS480G2G0B Mario Em ter., 25 de fev. de 2020 =C3=A0s 21:12, George Michaelson escreveu: > you said "hybrid HDD" > > is this possibly about write-back vs write-through cache integrity and > some confusion in a driver over what is committed back in disk, and > what is not? > > this feels like a very nasty corner case. Could you be explicit about > versions and vendors? > > I am asking for selfish reasons: I have a lot of dependencies in a > large SSD backed ZFS postgres server on Dell, and I am about to commit > to a lenovo X1 Carbon 7/8th gen which would be SSD and almost > certainly was intended to be ZFS-SSD in FreeBSD. > > -George > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:22 AM Mario Olofo wrote= : > > > > Hello, > > > > I reinstalled FreeBSD 12.1 on my SSD (in the swap partition of my Linux > to > > test) and on my Hybrid HDD. > > > > Just configured rc.conf to start my wifi dongle, downoaded git, node an= d > > npm via pkg and... as you can see in my screenshot, > > the ZFS already shows corrupted data... > > > > Can't been able to load the FreeBSD from the HDD though, don't know why= , > if > > someone knows how to load the > > kernel from the HDD via loader on SSD or grub2, I can try =3D) > > > > Mario > > > > Em ter., 25 de fev. de 2020 =C3=A0s 20:18, Mario Olofo > > > escreveu: > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > I reinstalled FreeBSD 12.1 on my SSD (in the swap partition of my > Linux to > > > test) and on my Hybrid HDD. > > > > > > Just configured and rc.conf to start my wifi dongle, downoaded git, > node > > > and npm via pkg and... as you can see in my screenshot, > > > the ZFS already shows corrupted data... > > > > > > Can't been able to load the FreeBSD from the HDD though, don't know > why, > > > if someone direct me how to load the > > > kernel from the HDD via loader or grub2, I'll try =3D) > > > > > > Em ter., 25 de fev. de 2020 =C3=A0s 18:56, Mario Olofo < > mario.olofo@gmail.com> > > > escreveu: > > > > > >> Hello, > > >> > > >> I reinstalled FreeBSD 12.1 on my SSD (in the swap partition of my > Linux > > >> to test) and on my Hybrid HDD. > > >> > > >> Just configured and rc.conf to start my wifi dongle, downoaded git, > node > > >> and npm via pkg and... as you can see in my screenshot, > > >> the ZFS already shows corrupted data... > > >> > > >> Can't been able to load the FreeBSD from the HDD though, don't know > why, > > >> if someone direct me how to load the > > >> kernel from the HDD via loader or grub2, I'll try =3D) > > >> > > >> Mario > > >> > > >> Em ter., 25 de fev. de 2020 =C3=A0s 12:11, Karl Denninger < > karl@denninger.net> > > >> escreveu: > > >> > > >>> > > >>> On 2/25/2020 9:53 AM, John Kennedy wrote: > > >>> > On Tue, Feb 25, 2020 at 11:07:48AM +0000, Pete French wrote: > > >>> >> I have often wondered if ZFS is more aggressive with discs, > because > > >>> until > > >>> >> very recently any solid state drive I have used ZFS on broke ver= y > > >>> quicky. ... > > >>> > I've always wondered if ZFS (and other snapshotting file > systems) > > >>> would help > > >>> > kill SSD disks by locking up blocks longer than other filesystems > > >>> might. For > > >>> > example, I've got snapshot-backups going back, say, a year then > those > > >>> blocks > > >>> > that haven't changed aren't going back into the pool to be > rewritten > > >>> (and > > >>> > perhaps favored because of low write-cycle count). As the disk > fills > > >>> up, the > > >>> > blocks that aren't locked up get reused more and more, leading to > > >>> extra wear > > >>> > on them. Eventually one of those will get to the point of errori= ng > > >>> out. > > >>> > > > >>> > Personally, I just size generously but that isn't always an > option > > >>> for > > >>> > everybody. > > >>> > > >>> I have a ZFS RaidZ2 on SSDs that has been running for several /year= s > > >>> /without any problems. The drives are Intel 730s, which Intel CLAI= MS > > >>> don't have power-loss protection but in fact appear to; not only do > they > > >>> have caps in them but in addition they pass a "pull the cord out of > the > > >>> wall and then check to see if the data is corrupted on restart" tes= t > on > > >>> a repeated basis, which I did several times before trusting them. > > >>> > > >>> BTW essentially all non-data-center SSDs fail that test and some > fail it > > >>> spectacularly (destroying the OS due to some of the in-flight data > being > > >>> comingled on an allocated block with something important; if the > > >>> read/erase/write cycle interrupts you're cooked as the "other" data > that > > >>> was not being modified gets destroyed too!) -- the Intels are one o= f > the > > >>> very, very few that have passed it. > > >>> > > >>> -- > > >>> -- Karl Denninger > > >>> /The Market-Ticker/ > > >>> S/MIME Email accepted and preferred > > >>> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-stable > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-stable-unsubscribe@freebsd.or= g > " >