From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Feb 7 23:37:19 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B55BA16A418; Thu, 7 Feb 2008 23:37:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from harmony.bsdimp.com (bsdimp.com [199.45.160.85]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5959F13C447; Thu, 7 Feb 2008 23:37:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.bsdimp.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m17NWAlC093322; Thu, 7 Feb 2008 16:32:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 16:34:54 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <20080207.163454.-1471235838.imp@bsdimp.com> To: attilio@FreeBSD.org From: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <3bbf2fe10802070621h574f5d3kb4fbd86adbab11c@mail.gmail.com> References: <3bbf2fe10802070613mf2bf3feg5dcb480501fcfbbc@mail.gmail.com> <20080207141820.GR99258@elvis.mu.org> <3bbf2fe10802070621h574f5d3kb4fbd86adbab11c@mail.gmail.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 23:43:00 +0000 Cc: yar@FreeBSD.org, swhetzel@gmail.com, andre@FreeBSD.org, jeff@FreeBSD.org, alfred@FreeBSD.org, anderson@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org, dougb@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: [RFC] Remove NTFS kernel support X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 23:37:19 -0000 In message: <3bbf2fe10802070621h574f5d3kb4fbd86adbab11c@mail.gmail.com> "Attilio Rao" writes: : 2008/2/7, Alfred Perlstein : : > * Attilio Rao [080207 06:13] wrote: : > > 2008/2/7, Andre Oppermann : : > > > Eric Anderson wrote: : > > > > I think Alfred's point is really interesting. How many people that : > > > > don't use it that say 'axe it' does it take to override 1 person saying : > > > > 'keep it!'? : > > > : > > > The real question is how many people does it take to say 'I'll maintain : > > > it'? Just one. Without it, it will only bitrot as evidenced by Attilios : > > > question. NTFS is currently broken, just not as obvious because WITNESS : > > > didn't track and enforce lockmgr locks. : > > : > > Andre catched exactly my point. : > > The big problem is that we have a list of several unmaintained fs. : > > NTFS is in this list. The support is not reliable, it is only : > > available in read mode and eventually bugged. : > > I'm not sure I want to keep this if nobody wants to maintain it. : > : > All I'm saying is that I think this is a bit premature considering : > the users. Within less than 24hrs we've had a few users reporting : > in as users, I'm sure the fixes (now that we have some good assertions) : > are going to be trivial. : > : > Why not let it ferment/rot for a release cycle and then see what : > the story is? : : Obviously if we can fix it is better, but axing is an opportunity I : don't want to leave out and this is why I wanted to poll users about : this issue. Eventually, if an axing is decided, it won't happen in : short times but only once all situations for "migration" will be : probed and finished. WE SHOULD NOT AXE IT. IT IS TOO USEFUL. VERY RECENTLY IT WORKED VERY WELL. There's a lot of other systems in the tree that aren't nearly as useful that nobody is complaining about that are actually in much worse shape. Warner