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Date:      Mon, 14 Oct 1996 18:19:26 +0200
From:      se@mi.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser)
To:        taob@io.org (Brian Tao)
Cc:        se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser), freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org (FREEBSD-SCSI-L)
Subject:   Re: Wonky controller or drive?
Message-ID:  <199610141619.SAA04657@x14.mi.uni-koeln.de>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSF.3.95.961014114553.2494F-100000@rogue.io.org>; from Brian Tao on Oct 14, 1996 11:58:59 -0400
References:  <Pine.BSF.3.95.961014114553.2494F-100000@rogue.io.org>

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Brian Tao writes:
> On Mon, 14 Oct 1996, Stefan Esser wrote:
> > 
> > Hmm, adding the 7th drive caused problems ???
> 
>     No, not precisely.  This is the history:  sd1 was a 4GB Quantum
> Atlas to begin with.  That one died during a power outage about a
> month ago.  I replaced it with a 1GB drive in the meantime.  That's
> still seven devices.  I only recently replaced it with a new 4GB
> drive, since we were running out of room on the 1GB (Web and FTP
> server logs, mostly).

Ok.

>     The cable configuration hasn't changed, just that one drive.  sd0
> and sd1 (1GB boot drive, plus the new 4GB drive) are mounted
> internally in the PC (50-wire ribbon cable, about 40 cm).  The
> remaining drives are in two daisy-chained external enclosures, total
> cable length of about 150 cm (two lengths of external cabling, two
> lengths of internal ribbon cabling), out to the last drive.  The
> internal chain is terminated with jumpers on the Quantum.  The
> external chain has an active terminator plugged into the last
> enclosure.  Each enclosure has its own power supply and fans.  One has
> four bays (three drives) and the other has two bays (two drives).

Hmm, I count 3 internal and two external cables ...
I guess each internal cable is some 100cm, actually,
at least I've yet to see a shorter cable being 
delivered with a system. (Well, if you made it from
components yourself this is different :)

> > I expect this to be caused by either a too
> > long cable (for the transfer rate) or a problem
> > with the power supplies.
> 
>     What is the maximum?  6 m or something like that?  I should be
> well within spec.

I've seen problems with much less than 6m of cable,
and I would not trust single-ended Fast SCSI with more 
than 3m.

Don't forget, that those maximum length specs do only
apply to SCSI cable of a given quality (impendance and
capacitance), and your internal cables are probably far
from optimal ...

> > Well, my first guess would be the SCSI cable being 
> > too long (or not good enough) or the peak load on the
> > power supply being too high.
> > 
> > You can check the prior by using only slow transfers
> > (async. or at most 5MB/s sync). If the power supply
> > is at its limit, then you should be able to cause 
> > failures by increasing the seek rate (ie. do random
> > seeks with little data actually being transferred).
> 
>     Hummmm... what could I use to do that?  Running bonnie repeatedly
> on the 4GB drive for the random seek tests?  I don't think there is a

I'd rather use multiple simultanously running "find"
processes, startet half a minute apart in order to not
take advantage of the caches ...

> way on the NCR (unlike the Adaptecs) to specify the bus speed or
> sync/async mode.

Well, I use /usr/sbin/ncrcontrol for that purpose :)

# ncrcontrol -s sync=5

limits the transfer rate to 5MHz.

# ncrcontrol -t 1 -s async

makes target 1 only use asynch. transfers.

# ncrcontrol -t 3 -t 4 -s tags=0 -t 5 -s tags=8

disables sending tags to targets 3 and 4, while target
5 will receive up to 8 simultanous commands (instead of
the default of 4 for a device supporting TCQ).

# ncrcontrol -i
T:L  Vendor   Device           Rev  Speed   Max Wide Tags
0:0  Quantum  XP32150          576D  10.0  10.0   8    4
1:0  DEC      DSP3053LS        X442  10.0  10.0   8    4
4:0  TOSHIBA  CD-ROM XM-3601TA 0725   4.0  10.0   8    -
5:0  HP       C1533A           9406  10.0  10.0   8    -

# ncrcontrol -v -p 1
  total   XP32150  DSP3053L CD-ROM X C1533A   transf.  disconn interru  ---- ms transfer ----
t/s kb/s  t/s kb/s t/s kb/s t/s kb/s t/s kb/s length   exp une fly brk  total  pre post  disc
 26  174   26  174   0    0   0    0   0    0   6853    33   0  26   0    9.6  0.4  0.4   5.8
 43  153   43  153   0    0   0    0   0    0   3644    48   0  43   0    9.3  0.9  0.0   7.0
 40  188   40  188   0    0   0    0   0    0   4813    55   0  40   0   10.8  0.2  0.0   4.5
 30  168   30  168   0    0   0    0   0    0   5734    34   0  30   0   15.0  0.0  0.3  12.3
 73  363   73  363   0    0   0    0   0    0   5092    72   0  73   0   20.4  0.5  0.1  16.2

(Disk activity caused by "find / -print".)

There is a man page for ncrcontrol, BTW, and "ncrcontrol -?"
and "-s ?" give some information on supported options.
Regards, STefan



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