From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Sep 18 09:58:04 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42A09106566B for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2012 09:58:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mwm@mired.org) Received: from mail-ob0-f182.google.com (mail-ob0-f182.google.com [209.85.214.182]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBD9C8FC15 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2012 09:58:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: by obbun3 with SMTP id un3so12751989obb.13 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2012 02:57:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=user-agent:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:subject:from:date:to:cc:message-id :x-gm-message-state; bh=reLnuYMEa+Pq2Xfwv5TrRnNuSDnkhiNdclVWQaxtdlE=; b=TD0v3yCJkfM6Bzh5srgQ/SVyPcsgX8TujI3uFaK+1r52y59mUlW4bZCCHAisH45s5h QXVZ/bdEXJFvdqiTQ54uhdRioyi8Zp6qaxzeEjQWxASvye8UY1sGeK6fy+xaKlwn+SpG 92vX9/6qclZEtTAvL7yxGyD0Zm0wIqPkS1XTJ8+rPNJizovUIg6E1nSjqqAUFB1FUksV R0TRQ6/BQR3tBnjmbHQyJelk8KNWgdsnGnQpXGSjpSP+RUN6wvLkRsJlZ8XDYFU1qRB/ zOF1rBBVbS+cT90i4tNc65E0wcygHfBE29wZSZFAP/VEFhfSg/Iqv58hyfbsGRx96LIj a0Dw== Received: by 10.182.207.71 with SMTP id lu7mr14146045obc.78.1347962277011; Tue, 18 Sep 2012 02:57:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from android-17cbdb9246b29c31.mired.org (ip72-200-195-210.ok.ok.cox.net. [72.200.195.210]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id ql3sm13920112obc.17.2012.09.18.02.57.56 (version=SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Tue, 18 Sep 2012 02:57:56 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: References: <5057906C.9090002@madpilot.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Mike Meyer Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2012 04:57:53 -0500 To: Zhihao Yuan ,Guido Falsi Message-ID: <9f2044aa-1413-40d2-966f-b9f0294b4210@email.android.com> X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnXwD9EszjjVM9irA9XVj+o4ZrMG3aHN9V9tWXG0xAY8aMXHOII648xjwc6KxTXVNc60KzV Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: My explanation to "a default DE" (was "Providing a default graphical environment on FreeBSD") X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2012 09:58:04 -0000 Zhihao Yuan wrote: >As u can see, it's a stand alone app. But the most widely used wifi >managers are always taskbar applets -- something bound to a specific >DE. -- There are a number of taskbar applications not bound to a DE (dzen2, mobar, gkrellm2) which have plugins for managing the kinds of things you're talking about. The X protocols provide a way for such applications to declare themselves as "bars", and for other interested applications (usually WM's) to discover the screen geometry both with and without bars. >we must standardize a ${DE}! Why? So far, the only advantage you've cited is that users can get a supported, documented desktop on FreeBSD (except there's nobody to support or document it) and developers could get a documented desktop to write apps for (except there's again nobody to document it, and you're the only developer asking for it), and you haven't said anything bad would happen if this doesn't happen.