From nobody Thu Jun 11 22:01:15 2026 X-Original-To: freebsd-ppc@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4gbxSG1jxtz6gjWV for ; Thu, 11 Jun 2026 22:01:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adrian.chadd@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qk1-f176.google.com (mail-qk1-f176.google.com [209.85.222.176]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "WR4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4gbxSF4pQkz3wwN for ; Thu, 11 Jun 2026 22:01:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adrian.chadd@gmail.com) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: by mail-qk1-f176.google.com with SMTP id af79cd13be357-91587626ae1so41444485a.3 for ; Thu, 11 Jun 2026 15:01:28 -0700 (PDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1781215287; cv=none; d=google.com; s=arc-20240605; b=HM2NXgdt1qhYZoCp/+REHcc0Ccc4+ybNCJwRp/Kz4DMKS5sxfmhZVp2Cq0n/WpMiqT Ut1Xgto+d5WgnpmjPSaYBVPEDgrWDWe3EmHIuSZOV8g8pdWfJonqrqYMWXbERRbQw0F/ pkjpjYlzAbb1zznu9BQv00KoF/bAnhsQLozOInNhXXqfFclTabVdGQ8B1nVLoG2jY0f8 YMiJEtdvbEfKizfOozKOnVwae5wiHDFOLiB2Orbzt+HyKrkH2SzNI8oIm69rVJEs48DM KXDg4sHFb2KzB1q4y3PFPAR1Hwkt9tqgx9BWq19dfs0z51ZRQg1dxIfQDs7ZFyfTMi3j o+iw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=arc-20240605; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version; bh=FbkJo4dq2/K2nrc/n3sJLDiGruDIE5QkT+HXJOFhel8=; fh=m79KtjqDAQ1WN2aHOXsnEscAa1F2FAXhGNIlhI4DXQM=; b=EBDT9BxX8fktff/v6p/zNaBRaIDVEvyARqe/v/l4khZ5kG2poUC0vdb/sjo0qIVQEB 1ls1zK07d6T24ZfpNY0zfBEEG/z1PTeN+PPr40gOCjB+Q6uJnRI2q2y2mZ+CfzGc9ugR 2AL71iB3GGucIeWOiO60wxN2Ep2Ly3S6f3vlb47Lx0cK8L8wTbHsuvG8RWGFqLaVWeQ1 uyztUKC10AbABZgkNuvEzmsIthV404LwgjtfaxFJWvEH5/EKZEFHu+8YQWQO1MmORd8j wreFnzSmtQ/jTjbwo0RG+P6q1klror6QPanm0R+5VylMTv/HTk+8cRPaT2GZNgsIqIfg l4Dg==; darn=freebsd.org ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.google.com; arc=none X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20251104; t=1781215287; x=1781820087; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-gg:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=FbkJo4dq2/K2nrc/n3sJLDiGruDIE5QkT+HXJOFhel8=; b=oUv0JMeT94qtSaHYTOwZLbjB6XleYzMMdt8CKT6bJcVr6bGBs+7wVY2UQscexn94IC Paclx/EVgyxK5y0yqNbdFRTJFrgebQhVL8XxDgLcvCDj7yIdX40Erv4eyAP24fTxmK7p TYmqae4a+jrLcbcvGUDHIxNgtWsGB7MUhAhpnHpBFaIiedf4v1wsDbKL5dCvN2vfFpbF 2HeQMWrp7rRly3m712D640kE3N2QU/uQWTrQNNw4nXaOzVSfghxItL7VNBVwq3VKSajU fj971Rm3LA7RuJ0G981mpm3XJlz6d4CjitymuZAUOTPC3DLrEIq8Wsa/SudGukvkrkPv 55cw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwD3c+gj/dlJVdtmamk3f/XJ+U0dLtBR6kXwZNI8jz0iJuil3hW SM7dB7WUQDR65pmAk6HBhPZu4ttP1szo00elb/C4zUp72IyVZTf7vzcEafymsfNoSUKQYu06p92 YZaiV+InCRZZwxPaPMCxZrc7k0uD3iRs= X-Gm-Gg: Acq92OFCSWbPqhXiTxBVrsS1rzVVNehaJhSWrjGizLnpE5bsS+SsLj0HutJ5zSxiY9A NHVse4esfEv6ez4jzUCY5i/oJCpBgG+yEWUoeTzYd9Z+8af3At0ZZPqipuLL4WavSIQ7xoEafme M0YUtIa41nMW+3tHZZsXwQQYNfrXRQ5ASaxOZQnmoWMP+6OHmj62ccK/Ifbai3e7Q6v9f4zk15W bB3Zoky5xp8Wf9QNSp8+McSRVgQeFOwn5X06LqxQQf6yuH2X5pJ3W9xEABd9qnC3FCZDpMh6YTk eUAJgXNbeBaXIzyHISIdI9bWbNCnJdt9a2qW4oTlPORirqe7TRth+xKG1FXeuYDWueJF9V+mw4H GWNhRb0SFssH0i4nKnk9SxZmIHAc= X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:a2d2:20b0:916:1806:302d with SMTP id af79cd13be357-916180630efmr189262885a.58.1781215286855; Thu, 11 Jun 2026 15:01:26 -0700 (PDT) List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to the PowerPC List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-ppc List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-BeenThere: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.org List-Id: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: List-Owner: Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Adrian Chadd Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2026 15:01:15 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AVVi8CfVwUSUklNFgsqFEA7F6_Hh83IsmA32MAxCCWKa69k2gk_8IR4qL0Cpv7E Message-ID: Subject: Re: Proposal to switch powerpc64le to IEEE-754 binary128 To: Piotr Kubaj Cc: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4gbxSF4pQkz3wwN X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated On Thu, 11 Jun 2026 at 14:42, Piotr Kubaj wrote: > > On 26-06-11 09:54:09, Adrian Chadd wrote: > > On Thu, 11 Jun 2026 at 01:22, Piotr Kubaj wrote: > > > > > > On 26-06-10 18:53:11, Adrian Chadd wrote: > > > > So, a few of us chatted in IRC about it. > > > > > > > > * The minimum for PPC64LE was POWER7 anyway, right? > > > POWER8. Last I heard, POWER7 has issues with unaligned access, which is > > > vital on LE. All the toolchains assume POWER8 as given on ppc64le. > > > > * There's no easy way to deal with this in library versioning and > > > > such, so we should just rip the bandaid off > > > > * We can fix the ports as they come up. > > > Yes, and there's not much to fix. The good news is that reinstallation > > > won't be necessary, upgrade is just the usual buildworld + installworld. > > > > * people wishing to run stuff built on -15 or earlier should just run > > > > a userland jail. > > > > > > > > so given that! > > > > > > > > * Please include something to propose to put in UPDATING > > > The review at https://reviews.freebsd.org/D57388 includes UPDATING > > > entry. > > > > * Please explain what will happen with all the toolchains in -HEAD (eg > > > > all the gcc versions will use the right base type, we won't have gcc > > > > compiling a different ABI to llvm21, etc) > > > > > Compilers explicitly using C's long double will need updating. > > > Everything else will work as it is. I have tested bootstraps for Rust, > > > GHC, OpenJDK and SBCL - all of them work. GCC and LLVM will need to be > > > updated though to emit correct long double, otherwise code built with > > > them that also uses long double type will misbehave. I'm also currently > > > playing with ldc and it will also need to be updated. > > > > Ok, can you go investigate GCC and LLVM too? > The clang part of our FreeBSD patch will be upstreamed and can be > readily backported to our ports. Sweet. > > Regarding GCC, there's a configure option for IEEE long double, so we > would be modifying just a port's Makefile. Sweet. > > > > And go, maybe? Does go currently work on ppc64le? > > Go doesn't work, there's a ready patch from Raptor that upstream somehow > isn't willing to merge. Raptor is apparently working on it. I have no > idea whether Raptor's patch will need modifications. > > > > > > * Let's figure out when the flag day should be. > > > > > Since it's CURRENT, people should expect breakages, we can't provide > > > stability there. IMO it's better to do it sooner than later so that more > > > people can test it. If someone doesn't want to upgrade yet, we're not > > > Microsoft, we don't force upgrades. > > > > Hey if you're willing to drive it forward then great! We just need to make sure > > it gets done enough that we don't end up with half working toolchains in ports. > Hmmm, I pretty often do bulk port builds anyway, just usually not > CURRENT, because with debugging enabled it takes a lot of time (and I > prefer to keep it enabled because it's CURRENT). I guess after the > switch I'll run CURRENT builds more often. Ok. Let's pick a date and give anyone else a chance to speak up before you pull the lever and commit us to the path! -adrian