From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Sep 29 05:10:21 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84BABC00FC6 for ; Thu, 29 Sep 2016 05:10:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jedrzejczak.michal@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm0-x22c.google.com (mail-wm0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0D6FFB68 for ; Thu, 29 Sep 2016 05:10:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jedrzejczak.michal@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wm0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id w72so2778227wmf.1 for ; Wed, 28 Sep 2016 22:10:20 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=mBMgMwIPlHcFaSa3b+sNEuxEa6D4hdKoIDpZJ2D7MtA=; b=I1Gln9muDU3WyhV0UAj+1JHs8hdCNfjqBWm8fU6wC9JpH/bkSYRTts841cCuCEap7Z DK9z5Hq/r2T8qxFJJH0BRNgPufFUeRdJ1ONvjohlV4z5H8WTO4muaBFF6Wr4RJarsdUF aIe5kJBqlw6wjWLuwLkdzSLxysDCq10kAwgRSjfy1Dd7w2z6GeSB4JkRim/WMMFxQGsV iM5lXCsZyydo3n6xLKvzFdvxdTwre5M/r57gALC1L3OKNj4RD/Eqbwk9PP6DuoKHxld4 NwPvhDA6ccJ/QndVO2O0zFRIctikdORmGV49JKSM1QZ+IsthSHS780h5ZRBdlNidd4ED aZBg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=mBMgMwIPlHcFaSa3b+sNEuxEa6D4hdKoIDpZJ2D7MtA=; b=giCpYERrohLLd36Yia/asynYFMvAWHLc2jQ6rm4mYCJ78iyhzSGZxr9YzK8KezLTni xpKsCJIIG7aZWxN7QGuW4Wy0OWTydjgf6t9KwyA89Ce8GJsKFc49FLvqh0o92dfmjVIv nTpRnecNw2OV+Nb/ROF0hMD+6heDV6eiHG/pqesMXwTU2s9TXFGBe42IK3XfuT0IAvgI 9Kuj1+vp9AM50Ulxef0H5POXITTB2TzMq/nYzYfom+nYnx9cOG3ZTOjjebYkAREvgrl/ Kba6t7UZ+xcy12ipsI5/1joQcuqRnDuaTqSrzu0kYph0yzdLHD7k61PW0Z8uaeaztHuu oqvQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AE9vXwNjDf531+/j4bBfxJDmip/yoWtIzwuCxES+wA59KX4CWq/6QLU51CBKTx5Ab9E9OFPwfJp5A2WYg70YYQ== X-Received: by 10.194.93.198 with SMTP id cw6mr30736033wjb.212.1475125819077; Wed, 28 Sep 2016 22:10:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: jedrzejczak.michal@gmail.com Received: by 10.194.97.42 with HTTP; Wed, 28 Sep 2016 22:10:18 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <37046.128.135.52.6.1475074557.squirrel@cosmo.uchicago.edu> References: <0D6BF663-5C95-4625-B412-00E14EF97986@FreeBSD.org> <35.AF.06698.BEF4AE75@dnvrco-oedge03> <20160927134158.74c11036@archlinux.localdomain> <20160928091109.7aa95c9d@moonstudio> <20160928105420.7b1d117f@moonstudio> <37046.128.135.52.6.1475074557.squirrel@cosmo.uchicago.edu> From: =?UTF-8?B?TWljaGHFgiBKxJlkcnplamN6YWs=?= Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2016 07:10:18 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 6av1A4TtmZ4POpEzNXqXiXLFmRk Message-ID: Subject: Re: i386 version in future ? To: galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu Cc: Ralf Mardorf , freebsd-questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.23 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2016 05:10:21 -0000 Thanks everyone for answers, now I know lot of more what I wanted :) Regards Micha=C5=82 J=C4=99drzejczak 2016-09-28 16:55 GMT+02:00 Valeri Galtsev : > On Wed, September 28, 2016 3:54 am, Ralf Mardorf via freebsd-questions > wrote: > > On Wed, 28 Sep 2016 00:59:09 -0700, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk wrote: > >>You are comparing different CPU brands with each other . > > > > It's unrealistic to compare 32 bit and 64 CPUs, produced with the same > level of development. Could you provide some examples? > > > > Actually I'm comparing two CPUs from the same family. The CPU I'm using > for my desktop computer today and the last 32 bit CPU I used for my > desktop computer before I switched to 64 bit. > > > > My old 32 bit was an Athlon single core 800, 850 or 900 MHz, I don't > remember exactly, Socket A, so the consumption was between >=3D 42.6 W an= d > <=3D 49.7. My current, newer 64 bit dual core is an Athlon BE-2350, 2100 > MHz, Socket AM2, 45 W. > > > >>Assume that two CPUs are produced with the SAME technology . > >>A 64 bit CPU will contain more circuits than a 32 bit CPU , means more > power it will use because amount of power will be proportional to number > of circuit components and length of connection lines . > > > > But they are not produced with the same technology, the 32 bit > > Athlon I mentioned requires 1.70 V or 1.75 V, the 64 bit Athlon I > mentioned 1.25 V, they are anyway from the same family, they were just no= t > produced with the same level of development. > > This is true: the power goes mostly into charging and discharging > capacitances associated with FET gates (ans stray capacitances). Energy > associated with charge is (C*(U)^2)/2. If we use half of voltage this > energy drops 4 times! (hence consumed power drops 4 times). This is why > the highest frequency part (core) works at lower voltage than the rest of > CPU. Now, there is also capacitance C in that formulae, which roughly > speaking is proportional to gate area (it is more sophisticated, yet...). > So, the technology goes to twice as small nanometers (which are linear > dimensions of elements), then the capacitance diminishes 4 times. That is > why it only makes sense to compare "the same technology". Next, the CPUs > are more sophisticated than just a width of arithmetic unit which for 64 > bit would be twice than for 32 bit if CPUs were trivial devices. Actually > it is not quite so, thus processing some amount of 32 bit CPU work on 64 > bin CPU will (considering the rest equal) not require to spend twice the > energy as compared to 32 bit CPU. You will spend more energy, this is > correct, but not two times more. (Very crude analogy here is: powering of= f > unused CPU cores; somewhat parallel utilization of components of 64 bit > CPU when processing 32 bit stuff probably is less crude way of saying it)= . > > Anyway, thanks, everybody for refreshing and very insightful discussion! > > Valeri > > > > > The slower CPU, slower RAM, different hardware, IDE etc., made the old > computer almost half as fast, so it needs to run almost double the time, > to reach the same processing power. > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_CPU_power_dissipation_ > figures#AMD_Athlon_64_X2_.2F_Athlon_X2 > http://www.anandtech.com/show/557/3 > > > > Regards, > > Ralf > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > > "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > > > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Valeri Galtsev > Sr System Administrator > Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics > Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics > University of Chicago > Phone: 773-702-4247 > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions- > unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >