From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Feb 4 11: 2:51 2003 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6A5C37B401 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 11:02:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout.mac.com (smtpout.mac.com [17.250.248.88]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7CF743F3F for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 11:02:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from lomion@mac.com) Received: from asmtp02.mac.com (asmtp02-qfe3 [10.13.10.66]) by smtpout.mac.com (Xserve/MantshX 2.0) with ESMTP id h14J2lhn003455 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 11:02:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from mac.com ([67.98.154.9]) by asmtp02.mac.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15) with ESMTP id H9SSWN00.N3H; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 11:02:47 -0800 Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 14:02:41 -0500 Subject: Re: dillon@'s commit bit: I object Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=fixed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Cc: Magnus B{ckstr|m , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG To: Brett Glass From: Larry Sica In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20030204110551.00c54680@localhost> Message-Id: <3C66FB8E-3873-11D7-9842-000393A335A2@mac.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Pgp-Rfc2646-Fix: 1 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I've tried not to get drawn into this but.. On Tuesday, February 4, 2003, at 01:11 PM, Brett Glass wrote: > At 10:56 AM 2/4/2003, Magnus B{ckstr|m wrote: > >> I would consider a more open governance to be harmful. > > Most (if not all) failures in governance are created or > sustained by secrecy. > >> "Those most involved" need to be developers; they are the only ones >> investing anything in the project > > Nonsense. System administrators, documentors, and users engaged > I have to agree here. A broader representation of the total userbase might make for a more even representation. One that takes other factors into account. To be honest some of the logistics of the project have been sorely lacking. I do not have the expertise to do any hard core programming, does that mean i therefore should have no say? What if i write a number of articles, or am really helpful? Or maintain hundreds of freebsd systems? Does my investment seem less just because I am not a committer? I have an investment in FreeBSD. I have written some articles, even had one printed in daemonnews' print mag. I maintain a number of systems, i try and help others with problems. Just a thought > in advocacy also have large investments and must be represented. > > The limitation of voting to those with "commit bits" creates an > extreme bias toward those with their heads down and/or those > with egos heavily invested in their code; it also increases the > likelihood that "real world" factors will not be considered. > It is one of the reasons why FreeBSD receives so little press > and so little corporate support relative to Linux. Advocacy, > a crucial part of any such project, is not valued. > > There is truth in this statement. Engineers and programmers are not always good marketers, advocates or planners. That should be taken into account. A project w/o all three things, engineering, planning and marketing will always be hindered... - --Larry -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP 8.0 (Build 349) Beta iQA/AwUBPkAOWOeV8VtPCL3dEQJJHgCdFoCqT2igsdLZ4SyL/0lro9cWLg4An0fK 4IakVS/NPRdBubo9wrkqutHI =D2kg -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message