From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jul 21 08:31:56 2009 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F664106566C for ; Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:31:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kraduk@googlemail.com) Received: from mail-bw0-f224.google.com (mail-bw0-f224.google.com [209.85.218.224]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36E628FC23 for ; Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:31:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kraduk@googlemail.com) Received: by bwz24 with SMTP id 24so183216bwz.43 for ; Tue, 21 Jul 2009 01:31:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=IwTBfrNyesr2QlUY5wb0y6+hjnVrqBDryVSYFpzCSBI=; b=AHYYm/QSfo6KxgqoF+vM4G2z3n0i0xXV7iDg/2cSDCwBC+UG3VpzCJ7X+kpew2WXfc bI7n3Ygpqvbqi5a1Pp9hLfBFDRdQ6f/Fq1sIRaLJ7nOHczPqxvrF2sAqzOnv+raKUfYC tYiCdXU19orOOn7P3ZzP18LdtDTvIXJPxrDUo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=hZ1YerAzdN9vRjN3x1j2M6orZBnOzTuRCZo1DqlYAe/w/LV/6gddgLTO41xBgKm0we p3RrNEKHFJnrikqamy/kg5Mx6DT71Id/qsrXM7Rs4k4FJwUfaWB5oyevxQQrV94SZ2oH jxFc6UCOFEXWzAYjDJySHarKDwSz6kh658nRo= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.103.182.1 with SMTP id j1mr2719964mup.119.1248165114098; Tue, 21 Jul 2009 01:31:54 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4A64F35E.6070501@ish.com.au> References: <4A5D4D25.3040908@ish.com.au> <3c1674c90907201501j42f29bfbl987419edf04b1a8b@mail.gmail.com> <4A64F35E.6070501@ish.com.au> Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 09:31:54 +0100 Message-ID: From: chris scott To: Aristedes Maniatis Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Jurgen Weber , Kip Macy Subject: Re: Problematic upgrade from 7.2 to 8.0 with ZFS file system X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 08:32:20 -0000 2009/7/20 Aristedes Maniatis > On 21/07/09 8:01 AM, Kip Macy wrote: > >> The other solution is to install userland BEFORE you reboot into the new >>> > kernel, although that may cause its own set of problems. Whatever the >>> final >>> > solution, this needs to be clearly documented and ideally >>> freebsd-update >>> > needs to detect the problem and advise the user about what to do. >>> >> >> >> Do to the large version jump (v6 -> v13) the kernel interfaces aren't >> backward compatible with the tools. How do you think it could be most >> gracefully handled? >> > > I honestly don't know how the right way to solve the problem, but here are > some ideas: > > * the kernel ABI *should* be compatible with userland tools at least one > major version backward. I understand that this might now be impossible, but > it is possible to bring back enough of the old ABI to allow for zfs to > mount? > > * freebsd-update could automatically detect this situation and install the > new zfs userland at the same time as the new kernel > > * lots of of clear documentation about what course of action a user should > follow if they are performing a source update. Should the recommendation be > changed to install userland *before* rebooting, and then immediately reboot > before some of that userland explodes against the old kernel in memory? > > The existing recommendation is based on the fact that the new kernel will > continue to work after reboot with the old userland. If that assumption is > not always true then the whole FreeBSD installation process needs > rethinking. > > > > Ari Maniatis > > > > --------------------------> > ish > http://www.ish.com.au > Level 1, 30 Wilson Street Newtown 2042 Australia > phone +61 2 9550 5001 fax +61 2 9550 4001 > GPG fingerprint CBFB 84B4 738D 4E87 5E5C 5EFA EF6A 7D2E 3E49 102A > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > how about doing things the opensolaris way. I have a pure zfs system with the root fs stored on system/root. This could cloned, to system/root-8, the new world and kernel installed, then the relevant bits tweaked in the loader.conf and zpool. If all goes wrong you switch the variables back and switch to system/root. It would also be nice to have some option in beastie to select your root fs for completeness