From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Jul 9 20:02:41 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 994C4665BF9 for ; Fri, 9 Jul 2021 20:02:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david.raver@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x333.google.com (mail-ot1-x333.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::333]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4GM3ww6GVXz3F7L for ; Fri, 9 Jul 2021 20:02:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david.raver@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x333.google.com with SMTP id w8-20020a0568304108b02904b3da3d49e5so6649521ott.1 for ; Fri, 09 Jul 2021 13:02:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=iRcpmdNP5gUpp7PXOWO5zdDSUvDyljYoL13Qo/S0/pM=; b=YufKl5imPUJy9INi9F5E4NaCLUu7bMDkS2BvpCB8neAS/ifQ9CBUbQHmdoSXv0RLc5 abaFbL8NchZRVzQgUebdy74JUP4CyNW43G0W6QIHVTCvt+MX/nbVjTYfDK5ckgTiCGCQ VVXJ6T7ge+Egh/h1HquKWBqIDg0s2d7BqM3XwG5RU6x4EDq2dt6LoV5vbipZ6J/2lZTH XRpsL+ksQaXHpKaoiVLsoCRB6jsZ/JXHvg/NYJkydwVbCS2/IxhZDIG6w3KsgnG37UhF biRP8ZIm/KxHAdPzn7hLriKMNdRLKiEJs3na/qt+OwoCWXa0OyL+D7vPHGRPnGlSlwS3 7HeA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=iRcpmdNP5gUpp7PXOWO5zdDSUvDyljYoL13Qo/S0/pM=; b=jFIU6TDFj3Nvp1V7RRuBWzegel0RnI1BLUvtttCjYt+KhPquJ8vHOwMJJbwCsJbl07 noRwmG6FdmtDc3mnzyhQ4wmkqGneUHf9aPC7VeqoGg8uPN8hv/MyrxDIQCStnwXlCJqa 4n1TTSUGBfWRiUerKMIv0Ns8boyZvXJ1Z1nA3mw1+MYa1yNENP8v6YLv+062tBf4NTDd Jp0XCAcuYs5Oa9Or2ZcDkdSJBELaaVAD4ntlwEFuDxoJFCEg+Bktxia8SsPXsc+pGyKN j739WtJzqSuL25yuP7js7r/YKf6oNSj5dTMJPSKCrcQJkmXj5QgHtXpXLL5OLqxyxUtY /bmQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5309t1V8G6JNh4fcE2U3fI5E20UpqDa2CGoGb7o+99Hre4ybr5mz 4LzWqCFP7iUkrmLKZC96DNEQKW3oVHGWm2Bs2hD7+BJGPss= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzMs5lbC74TjkCEEZYcQqPX+CN6I5/MVUccIb6Qqls0EpIYFh5QlfPGV702PcXq+JuH5rtVE1oQTmATiDSRzVs= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:4911:: with SMTP id e17mr30421947otf.38.1625860959847; Fri, 09 Jul 2021 13:02:39 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Raver Date: Fri, 9 Jul 2021 22:02:29 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Goodbye To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4GM3ww6GVXz3F7L X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=YufKl5im; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of davidraver@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::333 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=davidraver@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.00 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RBL_DBL_DONT_QUERY_IPS(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::333:from]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[1.000]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; SPAMHAUS_ZRD(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::333:from:127.0.2.255]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2607:f8b0:4864:20::333:from]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; MAILMAN_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-questions] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 17:58:23 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.34 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.34 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 09 Jul 2021 20:02:41 -0000 To Whom It May Concern: This is not merely a question, it's mostly a complaint. Let me explain. Some time ago I started a (c++) project which I wanted to make as general (in an OS sense) as possible. Meaning: the same source (with as little of ifdefs as possible) should compile, link and run on as many operating systems as possible. So... out of the BSD family I chose FreeBSD as I'd read/heard that it had been... well... the best. I installed it into a VirtualBox. Can't remember how, but it was what a developer needed: a graphical environment, everything easily accessible. As it should be. Then the project was put aside for quite some time until a couple of months ago when it's extensive generalization was brought to a stage when it worked on Linux, MacOS and Windows, it's primary systems. So, I fired a VirtualBox up again meaning to try to build it on FreeBSD. Sadly it didn't work. Not that it didn't compile. It did. The linker failed, though. Researching why, I came to a conclusion that it's version didn't support what I'd needed. OK, I said, an upgrade should fix that. Not being small-time I decided to not only upgrade the c++ (g++) development platform, but rather the whole operating system. I looked up (on Google) how to do it and... I did it. I mean I started the upgrade. Pay attention now because here it's where it all starts: the upgrade failed in such a way that not only the c++ development platform was unusable, but the OS refused to boot. All I'd seen had been a black screen. Steam started to blow out of my ears, but I still kept it together. OK, I said, maybe the upgrade wasn't a good decision anyway. Let's start from scratch and install the latest version (13) which will automatically solve all of the problems. Fired up a VirtualBox, created a new machine using the downloaded ( https://www.freebsd.org/where/) file. Booted up with the option 1 (multiple users, as it should be the usual case, right?). Instead of the expected GUI and some dialogs creating the user account I was met with the console demanding username and password from me. What?!? The first thing that went through my mind was that if this had been the case with a certain Microsoft's operating system, it surely wouldn't have had the market share it has today. After a little research (man, I love the small print!) on your page I came up with the account data and logged in. OK, I said, this isn't going to do. I need a GUI and some developer tools. Let's install that. But, the OS said, you can't do that unless you're a superuser. No problem. Tried sudo as I'm used to from Linux. Nope. Tried su. It said: "Sorry". What?!? Google helped again: in order to do that one must choose option 2 while booting. Fsck!?! Obviously one must have a BSD degree to use a computer. OK, after a restart (and successful su) I googled about installing a GUI (KDE to be exact). Being unpleasantly surprised that, instead of a oneliner, one has to buy a new keyboard with an extended life expectancy in order to type an equivalent of Tolstoy's War and Peace. Man, how hard is it to put something in a shell script?!? Before embarking on such an enterprise, I read some more small print and found out that, before that, one has to install X (probably demanding another fresh keyboard). And before that one has to install something else still. Can't remember what because I shut the OS down and hit a couple of dels removing everything even remotely related to FreeBSD from my computer. So, before yous geniuses decide to make an OS even remotely usable so that an average developer doesn't need to have a doctorate of General BSDvity Theory in order to use it, it's Goodby from me Argentina. D.