From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 2 01:26:34 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BE2728F6 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2014 01:26:34 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-qg0-x234.google.com (mail-qg0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c04::234]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7DAB13DA for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2014 01:26:34 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-qg0-f52.google.com with SMTP id q107so6403130qgd.39 for ; Tue, 01 Apr 2014 18:26:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject :from:to:cc:content-type; bh=bc6o5lcTxpdbvCOtg1KrW9MsC37M8MfqrBRWzGEQECw=; b=tuLQJHTfCcyF72p6GHHwRXhjWhbIFSNAcdTgszUnHzHZ0FcKdX5LabDkCA8CK25WW/ v0Q2tIxYRNeOws5/cLLb9PjrqjPtJ3AqtrUimd24DkmA2OQu37iGyECc6DHi/M1uT9Zv nn/uQHUmobvl6G3LQ8wyDl96uEfUvmxBEC1wXbgHXPazMQnm5T3EJUmC0nDHIsd7kz79 hw8QJLXdO/sloOSnBY+wnmCUn5l/8TEk8jFqz6CF3/AgHqGSd2KN+/B5owiOIM+rT/Iu xB5e8LRi19fwih70wYOorkCEh8D+wTlUZSiNvizFaATyXn4h3atavtnzdWvplQu0y63e SPzA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.224.25.2 with SMTP id x2mr39824815qab.37.1396401993639; Tue, 01 Apr 2014 18:26:33 -0700 (PDT) Sender: adrian.chadd@gmail.com Received: by 10.224.50.143 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Apr 2014 18:26:33 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <201404012240.s31MeIe4073267@hergotha.csail.mit.edu> References: <082a01cf4db9$240d3e90$6c27bbb0$@FreeBSD.org> <533B3903.7030307@rancid.berkeley.edu> <201404012240.s31MeIe4073267@hergotha.csail.mit.edu> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2014 18:26:33 -0700 X-Google-Sender-Auth: Glw3UU2MIwJnugAqEpx1jNvikfc Message-ID: Subject: Re: Leaving the Desktop Market From: Adrian Chadd To: Garrett Wollman Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: freebsd-current , michael@rancid.berkeley.edu X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2014 01:26:34 -0000 On 1 April 2014 15:40, Garrett Wollman wrote: > In article <533B3903.7030307@rancid.berkeley.edu>, > michael@rancid.berkeley.edu writes: > >>I have been using FreeBSD on the desktop since 1997, > > Hmmm. I'm a bit biased here, but I've been using FreeBSD on the > desktop since, well, before it was called FreeBSD. It's still my > primary platform for nearly everything (except photo management, which > drove me to a Mac laptop so I could run Lightroom, and those few > remaining Web sites that still bury all their content inside Flash). > > But let's be clear that different people have different requirements > for a "desktop". My requirements are relatively simple: twm, xterm, > XEmacs, vlc, LaTeX, xpdf, a Jabber client (psi), $VCS_OF_CHOICE, > gnucash, and at least two Web browsers (I use Opera for most stuff and > Firefox for "promiscuous-mode browsing"). Once in a while, I even > need to run a remote X application over an SSH tunnel. A Web server > (Apache) and a mail server with local delivery and spam filtering > (sendmail+spamass-milter+crm114) round out the requirements. I do not > ever need or even want translucent windows, Zeroconf, 3-D games, or > nonlinear video editing. Audio playback only matters to the extent > that it's smooth and the settings stick. I write documents and code; > my desktop is a productivity tool, not a gaming platform, and it > performs that function quite well, thank you very much. > > Other people have rather different requirements, and that's OK. But > let's please not break the applications for which FreeBSD is very good > now (and has actually gotten substantially better). The problem (among many) is that you don't have those requirements but the Xorg desktop developers and the graphics driver / layer developers have those requirements and they're sure sticking to them. So, you're going to end up getting 3D/hardware accelerated graphics and crazy audio integration requirements for your web browsers soon, which drag in libdri_.so and all of the bugs that keep popping up with that. It's no longer "xorg just speaks to the graphics chip." -a