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Date:      Fri, 24 Mar 2000 19:57:12 -0500
From:      Bob Johnson <bobj@atlantic.net>
To:        Brad Knowles <blk@skynet.be>, Garance A Drosihn <drosih@rpi.edu>, Robert Watson <robert+freebsd@cyrus.watson.org>, Bob Johnson <bobj@atlantic.net>
Cc:        Warner Losh <imp@village.org>, audit@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: Portmapper enabled, IPv6 circumvents FW
Message-ID:  <3.0.6.32.20000324195712.009ab100@rio.atlantic.net>
In-Reply-To: <v04220806b501a2a30f3a@[195.238.1.121]>
References:  <v0421010fb5014bb01bc1@[128.113.24.47]> <Pine.NEB.3.96L.1000324083722.38246A-100000@fledge.watson.org> <v0421010fb5014bb01bc1@[128.113.24.47]>

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At 11:55 PM 03/24/2000 +0100, Brad Knowles wrote:
>At 12:07 PM -0500 2000/3/24, Garance A Drosihn wrote:
>
>>  I don't know what knobs freebsd has for sendmail, but perhaps
>>  we could have a similar option there.  Setup sendmail so people
>>  can 'mail' other people (running sendmail via crontab to empty
>>  out any pending messages), but not accept mail?  I am not sure
>>  that is a really good idea though...
>
>	rc.conf has default flags to pass to the sendmail daemon, if 
>you're going to start it up.  I suggest leaving off "-bd" by default, 
>so that it will fire off queue runners when necessary, but won't 
>listen to port 25 unless this option is specifically added.
>

I don't run sendmail as a daemon on my personal workstation.

What I tell anyone who will listen (not many) is that they 
should make a clear distinction between setting up a workstation 
or setting up a server.  Servers get no user shell accounts except 
those required to manage them.  A workstation gets no network 
services except the very few that have some specific reason to 
exist on that system.

Most new users of Linux (many of which we hope will end up with 
FreeBSD) seem to be setting up what are primarily single-user 
workstations that sometimes serve as the www/ftp server for a 
workgroup.  Such a system does not need sendmail running, because 
all of its mail needs are handled by an organizational pop/imap/
smtp server.  It also is not part of any collection of trusted 
hosts, so it has no need for another handful of daemons that 
are mysteriously enabled by default on many Linux distributions.

So, what _I_ would like to see (if something more elaborate is 
not feasible) is an install process that includes two basic 
choices: (1) set up a workstation, or (2) set up a server.

The details of what that means are a matter of personal 
taste, but beginners need some guidance in developing 
that taste 8).  I'd limit a workstation configuration 
to offering no network services other than ssh, maybe
telnet with S/KEY already enabled and initialized (if 
that can be arranged), and (as an option) Samba plus 
something that makes it easy to participate in a Windows 
workgroup or domain as a client (I haven't used Samba 
recently, but it didn't make a convenient client last 
time I did).

I know some of this doesn't fit the current install 
process very cleanly, but I think the general concept 
is worth persuing.

I'd move this discussion to another list, but I'm not sure 
where it belongs.  I'm pretty sure it no longer fits audit.

-- Bob


+--------------------------------------------------------
| Bob Johnson
| bobj@atlantic.net
+--------------------------------------------------------



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