From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Feb 20 10:18:54 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [8.8.178.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9DA677B; Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:18:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) Received: from theravensnest.org (theraven.freebsd.your.org [216.14.102.27]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F13C240; Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:18:51 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.0.2] (cpc10-cmbg15-2-0-cust123.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com [86.30.246.124]) (authenticated bits=0) by theravensnest.org (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id r1KAIhxs051546 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:18:44 GMT (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.2 \(1499\)) Subject: Re: PathScale EKO Path 5 not for FreeBSD anymore? From: David Chisnall In-Reply-To: <5124063D.2060604@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:18:43 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <5124063D.2060604@zedat.fu-berlin.de> To: "O. Hartmann" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1499) Cc: freebsd-performance@FreeBSD.org, Current FreeBSD , =?iso-8859-1?Q?=22C=2E_Bergstr=F6m=22?= X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 10:18:54 -0000 I forwarded this thread to Christopher Bergst=F6m and got this reply: > ---------------- > FreeBSD simply isn't a scientific computing platform - There isn't any = market demand, it's not designed for it, many of the tools commonly used = aren't available and the amount of work to change that is significant. = (I don't just mean technical, but also mindshare for those in the = technical computing field) > ---------------- > However, we haven't dropped support for it > = http://c591116.r16.cf2.rackcdn.com/enzo/nightly/FreeBSD/enzo-2013-02-19-in= staller.run >=20 > There's a few GPGPU related bugs we'd have to fix for it to work for = you, but those are pretty small and wouldn't take more than a few days. > ---------------- > We made some big changes in EKOPath 5/ENZO and development is closed = for now. We're trying to figure out a strategy which will have an = impact and be win/win for everyone. > ---------------- > Apologies if I may have dropped the ball on communication. I'm not = subscribed to -current or -performance and please cc me on any replies. >=20 > ./C A few additional comments: - FreeBSD libm really needs to get the missing C99 functions committed. = We have good versions of these written now (with better accuracy than = several competing operating systems that are successful scientific = computing platforms), but they need committing. Of the 31 test failures = in the libc++ test suite (which covers most of C++11) that I see = currently, 18 are due to missing C99 functionality. Most of the missing = functions are implemented, but committing them was held up by style nits = in the source code. This is just embarrassing. =20 - GPU support has been quite poor on FreeBSD, and this has a knock-on = effect on GPGPU. It's a mistake to think of GPUs as just things gamers = need and therefore not too important for FreeBSD - they're currently the = best performance-per-dollar accelerators available on the market and so = are of interest in a number of markets. If you or your company is using = FreeBSD and wants to do GPGPU things, then make sure that AMD, Intel, = and nVidia all know, and ideally let Qualcomm and ARM know too. The = FreeBSD Foundation has funded work on KMS, GEM and TTM, and so open = source driver support is improving. If you're willing to fund some more = of this work, then please get in touch with the Foundation. Most of the = companies in this space don't care what we say, they care what their = customers (and potential customers) say. They won't support FreeBSD if = there's no (perceived) demand, so it's important to make sure that = they're aware of the demand. - A big part of the problem is mindshare. Linux is seen as the thing to = use on clusters and supercomputers, even when it isn't the best tool for = the job. It's hard to contradict this view when there aren't any = (public) large-scale deployments of FreeBSD for scientific computing. = If you have one that you're willing to talk about, please contact the = Foundation and let them know. =20 David=