From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 21 20:38:05 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BCF3106566B for ; Tue, 21 Aug 2012 20:38:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from perrin@apotheon.com) Received: from oproxy5-pub.bluehost.com (oproxy5-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.38.55]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4976C8FC0A for ; Tue, 21 Aug 2012 20:38:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 31391 invoked by uid 0); 21 Aug 2012 20:37:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box543.bluehost.com) (74.220.219.143) by cpoproxy2.bluehost.com with SMTP; 21 Aug 2012 20:37:36 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=apotheon.com; s=default; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject:To:From:Date; bh=WKQSsmU78aUHkrNEul9Zidq+vqWd9Ds2Mx5AIsW2ItQ=; b=hhhEIu49ZSS90qYDSmhc2yDd5rEdGD6XHBFztbl+HDiimH8UQ4kK4xTmdsIOkc72Nk9TNMRqisTirqa2WneWPmY8gPWy6mwF1Tobp+k3lz4b4lbZaPgrbY1AV7lbTsJC; Received: from [24.8.180.234] (port=60530 helo=localhost) by box543.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1T3vCh-0001jy-VB for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Tue, 21 Aug 2012 14:37:36 -0600 Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2012 14:37:35 -0600 From: Chad Perrin To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20120821203735.GB24554@hemlock.hydra> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Identified-User: {2737:box543.bluehost.com:apotheon:apotheon.com} {sentby:smtp auth 24.8.180.234 authed with perrin@apotheon.com} Subject: Re: Warning - FreeBSD (*BSD) entanglement in Linux ecosystem X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2012 20:38:05 -0000 On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 09:42:32AM -0500, Mark Felder wrote: > Those in on the core teams here are very well aware. Did you notice > we've survived this long without ALSA? :-) However, this is very > good reading for anyone who hasn't looked at Linux lately, and it's > worth mentioning that this is snowballing quickly. I used to really > like some Linux distros. I've been working closely with FreeBSD for > 3 years now and after watching Linux change in those 3 years from > this distance I'm not sure I want to go back. Everything that > originally excited me about *nix operating systems is gone; it's a > big convoluted mess now. This isn't a good sign and I hope someone > has the sense enough to stand their ground and tell > RedHat/Poettering "NO". > > > TEAR DOWN THIS WALL, MR GORB^H^H^H^HPOETTERING Hallelujah. Poettering and his ilk represent the gravest threat to the Linux ecosystem I've ever seen. I switched from Debian to FreeBSD in late 2005 or early 2006, having not touched FreeBSD much before that. Early the year before last year, I got a laptop and discovered that I should have paid more attention to what I was buying, because at the time FreeBSD didn't support the laptop's graphics. I thought "Well, Debian isn't as nice as FreeBSD, but it was pretty good, so I'll use that." Ever since then, I've spent uncounted hours writing hackish wrapper code to paper over the disaster area that is system management in the Linux world now. I wrote an article for TechRepublic about some of my experiences (and other gripes about the Linux world after five years away from it) titled "NetworkManager, the Fifth Horseman of the Apocalinux". The more we can avoid code written by Poettering and anything remotely like it, the better off we will be, I'm sure. Luckily, he wants to help us; he has stated that he believes writing quality, portable code somehow hinders "innovation", and as such he goes out of his way to avoid portability concerns. Good riddance. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]