From owner-svn-src-head@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jul 8 21:26:18 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-head@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAB42745; Mon, 8 Jul 2013 21:26:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from bigwig.baldwin.cx (bigwig.baldwin.cx [IPv6:2001:470:1f11:75::1]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78CAF1A16; Mon, 8 Jul 2013 21:26:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from jhbbsd.localnet (unknown [209.249.190.124]) by bigwig.baldwin.cx (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9A62BB982; Mon, 8 Jul 2013 17:26:17 -0400 (EDT) From: John Baldwin To: Garrett Cooper Subject: Re: svn commit: r253002 - head Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2013 17:13:51 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.13.5 (FreeBSD/8.2-CBSD-20110714-p25; KDE/4.5.5; amd64; ; ) References: <201307072039.r67KdCdR028908@svn.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <201307081713.51892.jhb@freebsd.org> X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (bigwig.baldwin.cx); Mon, 08 Jul 2013 17:26:17 -0400 (EDT) Cc: "svn-src-head@freebsd.org" , "svn-src-all@freebsd.org" , Alfred Perlstein , "src-committers@freebsd.org" X-BeenThere: svn-src-head@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: SVN commit messages for the src tree for head/-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2013 21:26:19 -0000 On Monday, July 08, 2013 2:23:31 am Garrett Cooper wrote: > On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 7:25 PM, Garrett Cooper wrote: > > On Jul 7, 2013, at 2:15 PM, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > > > >> On 7/7/13 2:01 PM, Garrett Cooper wrote: > >>> Why the magic number 12? > >> > >> Numbers higher seem to result in worse performance as reported by some members of my team. > > > > The suggestion is good in spirit, but this doesn't justify the reasoning for this recommendation for all cases. > > > > Please revert this change and add a doc page or notes to the dev handbook discussing what the empirical process and results were for determining this value so people can come up with their own values that work best with their hardware and software config. This recommendation is prone to bitrot like some of the recommendations in tuning(7). > > > > Misinformation is sometimes more harmful than no information. > > I spoke with Alfred over the phone and did some more careful thought > about this and I'm rescinding this request. > > Alfred did a good job at documenting how JFLAG works (it was > previously undocumented). My concern over -j12 was performance > related, and after giving things more careful thought it actually > makes sense why -j12 was chosen because Westmere and newer processors > have issues with NUMA and cache locality between multiple processor > packages as we've seen non-empirically and empirically at Isilon with > FreeBSD 7 and 10 (it's a known issue that jeffr@ and jhb@ are aware > of). > > I'll come up with a concise patch that does what Alfred was trying to > achieve and have Alfred review it. > > Thanks (and thank you Alfred for the contribution!!!)! Westmere is fine, it's post-Westmere that is more troublesome. I think the comment is not super useful, but don't object enough to want it to be removed. I always use 'make tinderbox' instead of 'make universe' though as I want build failures to be obvious. For the described use case of "checking if kernels build", 'tinderbox' certainly seems to be the more appropriate target. -- John Baldwin