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Date:      Mon, 18 Dec 2000 11:06:37 +0100
From:      Szilveszter Adam <sziszi@petra.hos.u-szeged.hu>
To:        freebsd-security@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: dsniff 2.3 info:
Message-ID:  <20001218110637.D6395@petra.hos.u-szeged.hu>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSF.4.21.0012172347240.48779-100000@security1.noc.flyingcroc.net>; from todd@flyingcroc.net on Sun, Dec 17, 2000 at 11:48:55PM -0800
References:  <Pine.BSF.4.21.0012172347240.48779-100000@security1.noc.flyingcroc.net>

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On Sun, Dec 17, 2000 at 11:48:55PM -0800, Todd Backman wrote:
> 
> FYI:
> 
> The End of SSL and SSH?
> 
> Yesterday, dsniff 2.3 was released. Why is this important, you ask? dsniff
> 2.3 allows you to exploit several fundamental flaws in two extremely
> popular encryption protocols, SSL and SSH. SSL and SSH are used to protect
> a large amount of network traffic, from financial transactions with online
> banks and stock trading sites to network administrator access to secured
> hosts holding extremely sensitive data. Could this singal the end of SSH
> or SSL?
> 
> Read the full story here:
> http://securityportal.com/cover/coverstory20001218.html

Hi!

I have read the article and here are my thoughts about it:

- First, this is nothing new, as the author also states. 
- Second, it requires raw access to the wire, which may or may not be
  available. Of course it probably will be in your typical university comp
lab or if you are on Ethernet otherwise.   

Now let's consider the scenario that the author presents us with. This
involves a man-in-the-middle-attack where the only thing the attacker does
is that she intercepts the messages on the wire and always re-encrypts them
and then passes them on. This scenario assumes that the parties have no way
of knowing who the other party is other than what they say they are and
also that they have not been in contact before. This will be most probably
true for SSL transactions, especially if the server's CA is self-signed
but  anyway for the user side. So if you are using SSL connections for
things other than say read your highly precious junk email from a free
provider, you should consider other options. Also, many banks are now
implementing personal certificates which they will pass to the client in a
secure (ie off-line either personally or via snail-mail) way. Smart card
readers are also more and more wide-spread in these settings. I think we
will see people use personal certificates more often in other places too.
(eg our national student ID card system in Hungary is a step in that 
direction. Countries where people are not used to carrying identification
with themselves usually face a harder situation.)

For SSH however, I see the problem to be not as big. If you are unsure, you
can always check if the server's public key is what you think it is. Eg you
can ask by phone, it can be on a web page etc. People normally use SSH to
places that they are at least to some extent familiar with, eg your mail
server. Also, the scenario described does require a constant spoofing,
because as soon as the attacker gets out of the way, you will discover
there is a problem. Of course, that will not help you a bit in what has
already been intercepted but at least you can take action to mitigate the
damage. Also, using passwords on SSH may be a good idea.

Of course, session-level encryption is a useful idea and should be used
whenever possible. Also, educating users about possible dangers is
important. Good network design and monitoring is also essential (but we all
know this already, right?:-) And you must always evaluate what your
security needs are. It is possible that the application is so sensitive
that you cannot place it on a network at all. It is possible that you must
force use in local network only. etc. As for injecting commands, well, this
may be dangerous as far deleting all the files in your home dir goes, but
root should never be caught unaware because, if you are root, and you see
that the server's public key has changed, you must know there is something
going on since you did not do anything to change it! Yes, this involves
also regular monitoring of your . files etc.

BTW dsniff 2.3 is already available in NetBSD pkgsrc. I think I will go and
play with it for a while now:-)

As far as upgrading to SSH2 goes, it is only a temporary solution as the
author also notes.

But, as long as people cannot be bothered to use SSH instead of telnet even
when they are hundreds of kms from here over the public Internet and give
out their credit card details in the clear and choose their dog's name as
password we have other problems to worry about...

-- 
Regards:

Szilveszter ADAM
Szeged University
Szeged Hungary


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