From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Oct 6 11:01:04 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6374EE07; Sun, 6 Oct 2013 11:01:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from erichsfreebsdlist@alogt.com) Received: from alogt.com (alogt.com [69.36.191.58]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 22D552468; Sun, 6 Oct 2013 11:01:03 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=alogt.com; s=default; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:Mime-Version:References:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date; bh=NFenFxJJ+sl5jTBE2rjRN9JkiFlmCEZX7Z8Z6eZloac=; b=rOlZpAU8b5fxKZKbSGPeL2ELFHvudld+4ohFzYVoQf6qL4ZjM8/qKOznC/OonLSELA0St84ZAKT6m+3Wd7g4d1v0Z8RHQppZCJFWrw1XdLh8sGxZMwAzz8e0xemLkaRiIh2Uf1kEwdTdW58aGa8c+jlD1G7xI7effIbg9WSSS+o=; Received: from [182.9.140.79] (port=26829 helo=X220.ovitrap.com) by sl-508-2.slc.westdc.net with esmtpsa (SSLv3:DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1VSm57-0010af-D4; Sun, 06 Oct 2013 05:01:03 -0600 Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2013 19:00:53 +0800 From: Erich Dollansky To: Mehmet Erol Sanliturk Subject: Re: About FreeBSD.org visitors Message-ID: <20131006190053.5757ef0a@X220.ovitrap.com> In-Reply-To: References: <201310031535.r93FZ6D1095088@mech-cluster241.men.bris.ac.uk> <20131003153825.GB1581@oldfaithful.bebik.local> <5250BA2E.3030409@FreeBSD.org> <20131006102955.4191e4a4@X220.ovitrap.com> <20131006120117.183b20ce@X220.ovitrap.com> <5251094E.2030800@FreeBSD.org> <20131006154515.01c14ded@X220.ovitrap.com> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.9.2 (GTK+ 2.24.19; amd64-portbld-freebsd10.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - sl-508-2.slc.westdc.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - freebsd.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - alogt.com X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: sl-508-2.slc.westdc.net: authenticated_id: erichsfreebsdlist@alogt.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Cc: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org, Matthew Seaman X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2013 11:01:04 -0000 Hi, On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 05:06:02 -0400 Mehmet Erol Sanliturk wrote: > On Sun, Oct 6, 2013 at 3:45 AM, Erich Dollansky > > wrote: > > > On Sun, 06 Oct 2013 07:55:10 +0100 > > Matthew Seaman wrote: > > > > > On 06/10/2013 05:01, Erich Dollansky wrote: > > > > this type is called 'design'. As an engineer I do the software > > > > behind an website but I do not dare to make the design. Ok, I > > > > tell the designer, when I think the design could be improved > > > > but I do not dare th change it myself. > > > > > > The trick is to realise that site design is simply another form of > > > engineering, albeint with rather different contexts and > > > constraints than writing software. > > > > > > Writing a website so that the users can interact with it readily, > > > find and understand what they wat, avoid frustration and have a > > > pleasant overall experience is conceptually much the same sort of > > > thing as writing a website so it doesn't hog server resources or > > > continually fail ungracefully or have a badly indexed sub-optimal > > > database schema. Basically you want it to do it's job efficiently > > > and smoothly, whether 'it' is the back-end server code, or the > > > on-screen presentation. > > > > > > Granted, optimizing sites for human interaction is a whole > > > different skill set, but it's not some holy task that only some > > > annointed designer with the mandate of heaven can undertake. > > > > yes, it is not rocket science but - as you said - a different skill > > set. > > > > Erich > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_engineering > > The first sentence : > > *Software engineering* (*SE*) is the application of a systematic, this is the mistake made here. We - at least me - talk about this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communication_design Nobody mentioned the software behind. Only the search function is mentioned very often as being behind current standards. Erich > disciplined, quantifiable approach to the design, development, > operation, and maintenance of software > , and the study of these > approaches; that is, the application of > engineeringto > software. > > > Thank you very much . > > Mehmet Erol Sanliturk